UK would be lucky to finish top 6 in ACC

[Cue Card]

You mean like the 9 ACC teams in the RPI Top 40? How about the 13 ACC teams in the RPI Top 100? Our bottom feeders have competed very well against teams out of conference. Clemson, who is in 12th place in the ACC, has a 3-0 records against the SEC. Pitt, in 13th place in the ACC, beat Maryland who is in the top third of the Big 10.

What grade do I give Louisville? Well, I thought they played pretty well. I give Wake Forest credit for holding serve at home. Wake has a so so record because of the conference they play in. Wake is in the Top 40 in the RPI. In fact, Clemson and Pitt who are in the bottom tier of the ACC, are in the Top 60 of the RPI. There are only two real weak teams in the ACC. That would be BC and NC State. But even those teams have been competitive at times but don't have many wins to show for it.

What grade do I give FSU for February? Well, we went 5-3 in the month of February in the best conference in the country with 5 of those games being played on the road so I think we did just fine.

Compare that to just 4 teams from the SEC in the top 40 instead of 9. The SEC does have 11 teams in the top 100, but 5 of those 11 are 74th, 80th, 81st, 83rd, and 91st.

Losing to the #40 RPI ranked Wake Forrest on the road is not considered a bad loss. As a matter of fact, UofL hasn't had ANY regular season bad losses this year and there won't be any either since the only regular season game left is against Notre Dame who is currently ranked #22 in the RPI.

 

[SchmidtyNole]

Compare that to just 4 teams from the SEC in the top 40 instead of 9. The SEC does have 11 teams in the top 100, but 5 of those 11 are 74th, 80th, 81st, 83rd, and 91st.

Losing to the #40 RPI ranked Wake Forrest on the road is not considered a bad loss. As a matter of fact, UofL hasn't had ANY regular season bad losses this year and there won't be any either since the only regular season game left is against Notre Dame who is currently ranked #22 in the RPI.

Yep. Louisville has a great resume. #3 in Strength of Schedule, no bad losses and plenty of quality wins. Louisville should be a 2 seed, the lowest they could drop is a 3 seed and they could still get to the 1 line depending on what happens in the next week.

 

[kyjeff1]

Really? Your team has squeaked by a bunch of garbage teams.

Factual evidence? The SEC is 1-32 against ranked teams OOC, your conference is getting too much credit for losing imo.

Yup, they sure did squeek by, but they won. Just like you saw last night, you got Wake's abslute best shot. The crowd was jacked up and UL lost.
UK wins that game, they've proven it time and time again. Wake is no different than middle of the road SEC teams.

 

[kyjeff1]

Compare that to just 4 teams from the SEC in the top 40 instead of 9. The SEC does have 11 teams in the top 100, but 5 of those 11 are 74th, 80th, 81st, 83rd, and 91st.

Losing to the #40 RPI ranked Wake Forrest on the road is not considered a bad loss. As a matter of fact, UofL hasn't had ANY regular season bad losses this year and there won't be any either since the only regular season game left is against Notre Dame who is currently ranked #22 in the RPI.

Bottom line is, conference road games are tough, even when you're playing at teams that aren't in line for an NCAA bid. I think we can both agree on that.

 

[Cue Card]

Yep. Louisville has a great resume. #3 in Strength of Schedule, no bad losses and plenty of quality wins. Louisville should be a 2 seed, the lowest they could drop is a 3 seed and they could still get to the 1 line depending on what happens in the next week.

Maybe but I personally won't count on anything until it's a fact. I recall when the Cards were ranked 4th in the country in both polls with a strong RPI and SOS and got saddled with a 4 seed. It made the team (and everyone with any level of common sense) mad. In the end, they made a run to the final 4 before losing to Illinois.

 

[Cue Card]

Bottom line is, conference road games are tough, even when you're playing at teams that aren't in line for an NCAA bid. I think we can both agree on that.

Our worse loss of the year happened last night and it occurred against a team that is currently ranked 40th in the up to date RPI. That's nothing to be ashamed of.

UofK lost to #80 Tennessee so comparatively speaking, you tell me which game was tougher? LOL.

 

[rockycard]

Yup, they sure did squeek by, but they won. Just like you saw last night, you got Wake's abslute best shot. The crowd was jacked up and UL lost.
UK wins that game, they've proven it time and time again. Wake is no different than middle of the road SEC teams.

Tennessee says hi

 

[kyjeff1]

Tennessee says hi

Ha ha, yes, that was an ugly loss. Freshmen can get four on the road. It was a 2 point loss early in conference play.
I wish Cal kept players around longer, starting a bunch of Freshmen in true road games can get ugly.

 

[ThroughBlue]

You've won a lot of SEC games with your C game. Like other posters have said, your C game wouldn't cut it in the ACC. We've had ACC road games where our A game wasn't enough and we've had ACC road games where we had our C game and got blown out. And yet we are undefeated at home in the ACC. In the SEC you can walk in, get the balls out, play your C game and then coast to a victory on most nights.

Thanks for the lecture. I've watched enough basketball over the years to forumulate my own opinions. There is no doubting that the acc is the best conference most years but you guys have some stinkers too. You guys have been a little on the lucky side on conference scheduling this year compared to a few of the teams but every team can't play the toughest conference games

 

[rockycard]

Thanks for the lecture. I've watched enough basketball over the years to forumulate my own opinions. There is no doubting that the acc is the best conference most years but you guys have some stinkers too. You guys have been a little on the lucky side on conference scheduling this year compared to a few of the teams but every team can't play the toughest conference games

Lol, they played six consecutive games against ranked teams.

 

[JohnKBA]

I don't understand how an SEC dumpster team like Vandy gets any respect for its schedule. BUT even if that respect is justified, you have to do more than just play the games. That team is barely .500 on the season.

No way in hell the SEC deserves five bids. They really don't deserve four but will probably get them.

"Elite program," my a$$...

Really? Your team has squeaked by a bunch of garbage teams.

Factual evidence? The SEC is 1-32 against ranked teams OOC, your conference is getting too much credit for losing imo.

Through all the noise these 2 posts make a lot of sense IMO - we can haggle all day about SOS, how good the SEC or the SEC's NCSOS is, etc, but at the end of the day, you have to win some friggin' games, right? If a team plays a monster schedule and goes 10-21, what good is that?

The SEC as a whole doesn't win enough NC games, then the middle of the conference all goes .500 vs each other and typically goes 0-2 vs the few good teams, and voila - you have a bunch of teams hovering around .500 both in conference and for the season as a whole.

So zipp and rocky, I think you guys are spot on with your posts here.

 

[shadow force]

I guess when you see a 12th place Clemson team that is 15-14 overall, 5-12 in conference and 3-0 versus SEC teams... mind you the same SEC teams you are touting as equal to Wake and ACC cellar dwellers, you can not wrap your brain around any SEC equating to middle of the pack ACC teams. Clemson beat UGA, Bama and SC. For some strange reason SC is touted as one of the better SEC teams. So, how can any equivalency be given to the SEC middle when they can not even beat an ACC cellar dweller? And, there is no doubt that ACC fans understand on any given night a team can step up and defeat the better team. It's just more likely to happen in a conference that is top to bottom stronger than any other conference in the country. In other words, there isn't a let down in the ACC.

I see this part of the post went unaddressed by the uk lurkers.

 

[JohnKBA]

You've won a lot of SEC games with your C game. Like other posters have said, your C game wouldn't cut it in the ACC. We've had ACC road games where our A game wasn't enough and we've had ACC road games where we had our C game and got blown out. And yet we are undefeated at home in the ACC. In the SEC you can walk in, get the balls out, play your C game and then coast to a victory on most nights.

I mean this probably sounds arrogant, but maybe the answer to that is "because we can."

As I pointed out earlier in the thread, UK's win % under Cal

SEC 79%
NCAA Tourney 82%
UNC/Duke/U of L 75%

I don't have the time or energy to go looking up specific records vs every conference, but UK wins at a high % consistently no matter who we play. The SEC is what it is - it's a football conference. UK isn't leaving and the rest of the conference isn't going to develop an affinity for roundball anytime soon.

 

[JohnKBA]

I see this part of the post went unaddressed by the uk lurkers.

I mean, you can pick out a handful of results across all sports and apply the transitive property to things with every team in history and surmise that one team/conference/division is better than another.

Nobody in here is disputing that the ACC is excellent and the SEC is sub par. The truth on both is probably somewhere in the middle. The ACC isn't the 2nd coming of Jesus, and the SEC isn't Hitler. I understand that on the internet, everything is described in its most extreme property, especially so on a message board.

 

[Cue Card]

The ACC isn't the 2nd coming of Jesus, and the SEC isn't Hitler.

I have to admit, that made me laugh out loud. It's a true statement but funny just the same.

If you had the chance to go back in time, pick up baby Hitler from his crib, would you shake him dead?

 

[zipp]

This years Kentucky team would be in the 6-8 range In the ACC imo.

I don't think LPT is equivalent to a middle-of-the-pack ACC team. Let's face it, they put a lot more emphasis on basketball than their other sports combined, and that gets the results they want.

This year, they'd be in the thick of the battle for seeds 2-4 in the ACC like Louisville, ND, FSU and Duke are. They're behind Carolina although LPT won one of their 2-3 annual Super Bowls earlier this season.

What LPT gets is no credit for being successful in the SEC. They don't get to advance in the polls or seeding when they win games while others take a loss or two in tough conferences. They get no credit for racking up conference wins, and they really get less credit for beating good teams OOC when their schedule is so hit-and-miss with quality teams generally. As slappy football fans have always said, it's easy to circle a few good teams on your schedule and get up for those games.

"Elite program." my a$$...

 

[shadow force]

I mean, you can pick out a handful of results across all sports and apply the transitive property to things with every team in history and surmise that one team/conference/division is better than another.

So since we'll likely never see uk in the ACC, and will never know for sure either way, then your opinion that uk would be at the top of the ACC isn't anymore valid than those saying uk would struggle most years. Right? I mean someone could say your results from the other post are just picked out because they fit your argument in this case just like the Clemson results against the SEC that the other guy posted.

 

[ThroughBlue]

Through all the noise these 2 posts make a lot of sense IMO - we can haggle all day about SOS, how good the SEC or the SEC's NCSOS is, etc, but at the end of the day, you have to win some friggin' games, right? If a team plays a monster schedule and goes 10-21, what good is that?

The SEC as a whole doesn't win enough NC games, then the middle of the conference all goes .500 vs each other and typically goes 0-2 vs the few good teams, and voila - you have a bunch of teams hovering around .500 both in conference and for the season as a whole.

So zipp and rocky, I think you guys are spot on with your posts here.

I agree I wouldn't have Vandy in the tournament. My only point was this. Joe Lunardi had them in. I didn't see how an away loss to Kentucky hurt them if they can win Saturday and win a couple in the conference tournament. If they lose Saturday they're obviously out. I was surprised as anyone to see lunardi had them in

 

[tluck28]

I guess when you see a 12th place Clemson team that is 15-14 overall, 5-12 in conference and 3-0 versus SEC teams... mind you the same SEC teams you are touting as equal to Wake and ACC cellar dwellers, you can not wrap your brain around any SEC equating to middle of the pack ACC teams. Clemson beat UGA, Bama and SC. For some strange reason SC is touted as one of the better SEC teams. So, how can any equivalency be given to the SEC middle when they can not even beat an ACC cellar dweller? And, there is no doubt that ACC fans understand on any given night a team can step up and defeat the better team. It's just more likely to happen in a conference that is top to bottom stronger than any other conference in the country. In other words, there isn't a let down in the ACC. If you don't bring your A game, the probability of losing is greater. UK's A games come against OOC opponents rather than conference opponents and that speaks volumes to the strength of the SEC. The converse is seen in the ACC where anything less than your A game in conference means a possible defeat.

This.....

 

[zipp]

...You guys have been a little on the lucky side on conference scheduling this year compared to a few of the teams but every team can't play the toughest conference games

Always humorous when a slappy starts lecturing on basketball conference strength as if it's from some perspective of familiarity or accomplishment. You guys have been in the SEC too long to understand what tough games in January and February really mean.

But not quite as funny as when you try it in football.

"Elite program," my a$$...

 

[JohnKBA]

So since we'll likely never see uk in the ACC, and will never know for sure either way, then your opinion that uk would be at the top of the ACC isn't anymore valid than those saying uk would struggle most years. Right? I mean someone could say your results from the other post are just picked out because they fit your argument in this case just like the Clemson results against the SEC that the other guy posted.

Can you please quote the post where I said UK would be at the top of the ACC? I can't seem to find it. Thanks.

 

[shadow force]

Can you please quote the post where I said UK would be at the top of the ACC? I can't seem to find it. Thanks.

Ok tell me your opinion then. You posted uk win stats against against UofL, UNC, and Duke, teams typically at or near the top of the conference, so I took it to mean that you thought UK would be at the top of the ACC.

 

[JohnKBA]

Ok tell me your opinion then. You posted uk win stats against against UofL, UNC, and Duke, teams typically at or near the top of the conference, so I took it to mean that you thought UK would be at the top of the ACC.

Understood SF - I think in any given year they'd be competitive, and the stats bear it out. Would they win it every year? No, they don't even win the damn sec every year. I think anyone saying they would "struggle" or be in the bottom half are being silly. At the same time, no uk fan should realistically think we could walk into the ACC and start racking up conference titles.

That's just my opinion

 

[JohnKBA]

I have to admit, that made me laugh out loud. It's a true statement but funny just the same.

If you had the chance to go back in time, pick up baby Hitler from his crib, would you shake him dead?

I dunno Cue - I watch Family Guy a lot and Stewie always says never disrupt the past during time travel - that one time Brian prevented 9/11, when they got back to 2014, the whole U.S was a war zone

 

[Cue Card]

I dunno Cue - I watch Family Guy a lot and Stewie always says never disrupt the past during time travel - that one time he prevented 9/11, when they got back to 2014, the whole U.S was a war zone

Yep.

 

[kyjeff1]

Thanks for the lecture. I've watched enough basketball over the years to forumulate my own opinions. There is no doubting that the acc is the best conference most years but you guys have some stinkers too. You guys have been a little on the lucky side on conference scheduling this year compared to a few of the teams but every team can't play the toughest conference games

Never thought we would get lectured about basketball by a Florida State fan. They have a decent year and now their fans know everything.

 

[BPGhost]

Never thought we would get lectured about basketball by a Florida State fan. They have a decent year and now their fans know everything.

Lol - tell that to your football board posters. The only difference is they still doled out lectures during joker's tenure.

 

[rockycard]

Never thought we would get lectured about basketball by a Florida State fan. They have a decent year and now their fans know everything.

Just because your team is good or bad doesn't mean that dictates a fans knowledge of the sport, that's typical thinking from your fan base though.

 

[kyjeff1]

Lol - tell that to your football board posters. The only difference is they still doled out lectures during joker's tenure.

Ugh, that happened?

 

[kyjeff1]

Just because your team is good or bad doesn't mean that dictates a fans knowledge of the sport, that's typical thinking from your fan base though.

No, not really, but fans like him usually only appear when there is some success, when they are down, you never see them around.

 

[rockycard]

No, not really, but fans like him usually only appear when there is some success, when they are down, you never see them around.

Gotcha, we didn't have any Kentucky fans on this board during the Gillispie era...

 

[JohnKBA]

Gotcha, we didn't have any Kentucky fans on this board during the Gillispie era...

Thanks a lot rocky, I had successfully terminated all recollection of that 2 year debacle and you bring it right back up

 

[SchmidtyNole]

Just because your team is good or bad doesn't mean that dictates a fans knowledge of the sport, that's typical thinking from your fan base though.

Right on. I am not claiming we are a blue blood basketball program like UK. This debate is about the strength of the ACC versus the SEC. And if we want to go there we have beaten UF in basketball three years in a row and they are the second best program in the SEC. And there were UK fans who were ribbing us about our Football strength of schedule during our 2013 National Championship season so I guess it works both ways. Lol!

 

[SchmidtyNole]

No, not really, but fans like him usually only appear when there is some success, when they are down, you never see them around.

You are right. When our team isn't having big success we know when to keep our mouth shut. It doesn't mean we don't have any basketball knowledge.

 

[Bigblueforever]

I would also remind you that yes you beat UNC in December, when Monk had a once in a lifetime type game, and still only beat UNC by 3. I feel the same way about UNC that I feel about us, that if the UNC-UK game was played now UNC wins by 10 - 15.

Hate is running away with you, If they play again in the NCAAT we will find out..

 

[94tarheel]

Thanks for the lecture. I've watched enough basketball over the years to forumulate my own opinions. There is no doubting that the acc is the best conference most years but you guys have some stinkers too. You guys have been a little on the lucky side on conference scheduling this year compared to a few of the teams but every team can't play the toughest conference games

Obviously you have no clue; because if you had a clue, you wouldn't have made such a moronic statement. For the record FSU went through a stretch in their schedule where they played 6 ranked opponents and went 5-1. @#11 UVA (W), #21 VaTech (W), #7 Duke (W), @ #11 UNC (L), #15 ND (W) and #13 Uof L (W). Now, you were saying?

 

[rockycard]

Hate is running away with you, If they play again in the NCAAT we will find out..

Lol, we sposed to be skeered?

 

[94tarheel]

I mean, you can pick out a handful of results across all sports and apply the transitive property to things with every team in history and surmise that one team/conference/division is better than another.

Nobody in here is disputing that the ACC is excellent and the SEC is sub par. The truth on both is probably somewhere in the middle. The ACC isn't the 2nd coming of Jesus, and the SEC isn't Hitler. I understand that on the internet, everything is described in its most extreme property, especially so on a message board.

Unfortunately for your argument, it isn't the transitive property. Clemson actually is undefeated versus SEC teams. SEC basketball OOC record IS horrid when compared to other power 5 conferences. It isn't like the transitive property where if Wake is better than Carolina because Wake beat U of L who beat Duke who beat Carolina. That is the transitive property and that isn't what happened. Clemson is undefeated against middle of the pack SEC teams that UK fans championed as being on par with middle of the pack ACC teams. Unfortunately, Wake isn't middle of the pack and neither is Clemson.

 

[JohnKBA]

Unfortunately for your argument, it isn't the transitive property. Clemson actually is undefeated versus SEC teams. SEC basketball OOC record IS horrid when compared to other power 5 conferences. It isn't like the transitive property where if Wake is better than Carolina because Wake beat U of L who beat Duke who beat Carolina. That is the transitive property and that isn't what happened. Clemson is undefeated against middle of the pack SEC teams that UK fans championed as being on par with middle of the pack ACC teams. Unfortunately, Wake isn't middle of the pack and neither is Clemson.

Whatever Heel. I'll sit back and enjoy our current win streak against you guys.

Transitive property is a very specific math term that is used liberally when applied to sports all the time. If you want to pick on my use of it, have at it.

 

[94tarheel]

Whatever Heel. I'll sit back and enjoy our current win streak against you guys.

Come on man, don't be like that. Yeah, I hate it. Guess I will just lean on that 23-15 overall record between us.

Look, there is no doubt that UK would be in the hunt for an ACC crown or two; but, to continue to go down that line of thinking with regard to SEC middle of the pack teams is crazy. It's UK and no one else for years until UF arrived, left and came back to some success. I would love for UK to be in the ACC. Would be an insane basketball conference.