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Jay Reimenschneider said:
My God you're hopeless! You just spew crap all the while saying nothing. Iowa St wasn't a 1 seed. You seem to be hitting the bottle or the bong early today. No one knows why you're here.
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Haha, You're eat up with me because you know I'm right. You grasped at a typo to try and disprove me. Iowa St had 11 losses 4 seed 5-7 in their last 12 games, Baylor 11 losses yet received the same seed as the Big 10 reg season champ, Texas 12 losses 6 seed, West Virginia 8 losses 3 seed, Texas Tech 19-12 8 seed.

The Pac 12 was seeded similarly, both conferences received higher seeds because the conferences were perceived to be strong.
 
I'm "eat up" with you because you're an insufferable poster who had for some reason landed on this board (where no one wants you btw) and infected us with his stupidity
 
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JohnKBA said:
All that said, I don't put a bit of stock into the conference schedule not preparing a team for the post season. If a team is well balanced, well coached, experienced, and talented enough, it wins in March regardless of the schedule it played.
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I agree with a lot of what you said describing the SEC, but I have to respectfully disagree with part of your analysis. It's true that balanced, well coached, experienced, and talented teams can win in March. The experience Kentucky players have gotten the past two years in February is that they can manhandle and dominate weaker teams, and if they make a few mistakes here and there it doesn't hurt anything.

To me, there's a big difference between playing weaker teams where your star players can do whatever they want, and having those players challenged where they have to work harder to get open, work harder to make plays, work harder to rebound. A weak team isn't going to expose your weaknesses and give you something to work on.

When you play week after week and make sloppy mistakes, and it doesn't hurt you, teams develop bad habits and lose intensity. It's human nature.

Playing a tougher schedule, having your weaknesses exposed and getting punished for sloppy play and careless turnovers with losses toughens a team up for March Madness. Playing against the best of the best and still losing toughens a team up. You learn nothing about your team playing cream puffs, and since they can't exploit your weaknesses, it gives you nothing to work on to improve.

I just think that right now, once UK gets to the Tournament and faces real competition, they have a tough adjustment. They finally get their weaknesses exposed by a team that can exploit them, but there's no time to work on anything when you're playing for your life.

I'm not complaining, just pointing it out. :)
 
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Bill Derington said:
Reality is considered stupidity to you, Hmm thats not surprising.
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Watch it, stud. You haven't earned the right. How shocking would i be to you to consider you might be viewed in precisely the same light?

Inasmuch as you are a rhetorical UK monster, well-versed in message board argumentation, perhaps you actually believe you are accomplishing the triage you believe UK needs with your efforts.

I'd say you are about 8 years late. You missed your chance back when your fans resembled humans. Now, it's just redundant syllogisms, acing your own little lurker and trolling test.

It's remarkable your lack of sensitivity, actually. You are earning bad vibes and your own invitation outta here. You have absolutely no take on anything unUK related, lol. It's what slapdicks do - there simply is no other team. You are the UK Whisperer, lol..with little or no redeeming value to this board.
 
UK doesn't triage Senore.

I was simply pointing out the ridiculous point of Zipp's post, and you decided to chime in. I also don't think you're stupid, far from it.
 
Dude, you triage like a mother f----r, lol. All of you do. All your rhetorical nonsense is completely dedicated to your effort to raise - or resurrect in our case - UK's profile. It's not because you are on some mad search for the truth. If you were, you would be loudly taking issue with the ultimately absurd conventional wisdoms at your home site and the psychotic opinions of your weird fan base. Real change starts at home, my friend.
 
UK doesn't need my help Senore, it's in good shape.

Arguing with a rival fan isn't triage, it's simply what rival fans do. I try to keep it respectful, I haven't taken any cheapshots of the current situation.
 
Mike'sMarbles said:
I agree with a lot of what you said describing the SEC, but I have to respectfully disagree with part of your analysis. It's true that balanced, well coached, experienced, and talented teams can win in March. The experience Kentucky players have gotten the past two years in February is that they can manhandle and dominate weaker teams, and if they make a few mistakes here and there it doesn't hurt anything.

To me, there's a big difference between playing weaker teams where your star players can do whatever they want, and having those players challenged where they have to work harder to get open, work harder to make plays, work harder to rebound. A weak team isn't going to expose your weaknesses and give you something to work on.

When you play week after week and make sloppy mistakes, and it doesn't hurt you, teams develop bad habits and lose intensity. It's human nature.

Playing a tougher schedule, having your weaknesses exposed and getting punished for sloppy play and careless turnovers with losses toughens a team up for March Madness. Playing against the best of the best and still losing toughens a team up. You learn nothing about your team playing cream puffs, and since they can't exploit your weaknesses, it gives you nothing to work on to improve.

I just think that right now, once UK gets to the Tournament and faces real competition, they have a tough adjustment. They finally get their weaknesses exposed by a team that can exploit them, but there's no time to work on anything when you're playing for your life.

I'm not complaining, just pointing it out. :)
Click to expand...

Great post Mike's, I think there is probably some truth in what you've said here. Be careful though, being respectful with the enemy seems to be frowned upon around these parts :)
 
Bill Derington said:
Are we not talking about the NCAA tourney on a Basketball board?
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Yes, but your comment was about UofL possibly getting "thrown to the wolves" by the ACC. I assume you were making that statement regarding the current situation - my point was, regardless of what happens Louisville isn't going anywhere - the ACC wants them and that hasn't/won't change regardless.
 
I didn't mean the ACC was going to kick Louisville out. I meant that Tobacco Rd rules the conference, and they're going to protect UNC at all cost.
 
Senore2006 said:
Pretty hard sell over here, stud. We know you too well to change, lol. That's not a statement of endearment.........just too much information. Who the f--- wants to be you? That's hilarious.
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a running joke with Zipp, you haven't a clue. nothing to concern yourself with, wasn't talking about UL just to Zipp.
 
Steelers2012 said:
As I said, Louisville was/is ONE of the teams that could be pointed to as an example of a physically aggressive team. If rule makers were looking to reduce physical play, then yes, certainly Louisville's physical style could be an example of what they want to reduce. However, to claim the rules were changed in reaction to UofL winning the 2013 NC with their physically aggressive style would be inaccurate.
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agree
 
Senore2006 said:
Watch it, stud. You haven't earned the right. How shocking would i be to you to consider you might be viewed in precisely the same light?

Inasmuch as you are a rhetorical UK monster, well-versed in message board argumentation, perhaps you actually believe you are accomplishing the triage you believe UK needs with your efforts.

I'd say you are about 8 years late. You missed your chance back when your fans resembled humans. Now, it's just redundant syllogisms, acing your own little lurker and trolling test.

It's remarkable your lack of sensitivity, actually. You are earning bad vibes and your own invitation outta here. You have absolutely no take on anything unUK related, lol. It's what slapdicks do - there simply is no other team. You are the UK Whisperer, lol..with little or no redeeming value to this board.
Click to expand...
Your wrong about one thing Senore. You have to go back a lot longer than 8 years to find the UK fans like that. The most entitled, revisionist racist bunch of fans I have ever ran across. The only thing that would make them happy is for the world to acknowledge their greatness based solely on the fact they root for UK. I'm 52 and it's been that way as long as I can remember.
 
zipp said:
The updated NCAA record for ACC teams thru Sunday's games is now 61-29 (0.678). The SEC is now 25-20 (0.556). Again, these are tourney games since 2010 excl. LPT and U of L.

Except for LPT, the SEC has now played exactly half as many NCAA tournament games as the ACC excl. U of L in that time frame. The NCAA bids tell the same story. There are about half as many tournament-quality teams in the SEC vs. the ACC. And those fewer teams don't individually do as well as their ACC counterparts.

"Elite program", my a$$...
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Come on Zipp don't you know strength of Conference only matters in football? The fact that their all time win record is built playing a bunch of crappy Conference teams year after year is besides the point.
 
JohnKBA said:
...All that said, I don't put a bit of stock into the conference schedule not preparing a team for the post season. If a team is well balanced, well coached, experienced, and talented enough, it wins in March regardless of the schedule it played. The problem Calipari has is that he rarely has any "experienced" talent on his teams. His reputation for churning out one and done players is detrimental to winning YoY since guys who have no business leaving end up in the D League or washed out within a couple of years. Yes, this is the bed Cal makes so he has to lay in it. Ultimately he should have one more title at UK IMO. Either 2010 or 2015 UK should have figured out a way to win it all, especially when you look at how good the main players on those teams are right now in the NBA. Wall and Cousins are perennial all stars, Towns is headed that way, Booker and Lyles have been excellent...
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You have the better perspective on your own team as far as the regular season. I probably don't watch 40 minutes of your team for five months, but I do watch the postseason.

Where I would disagree is your assessment of the how well LPT is prepared. I'd argue that LPT isn't seriously tested in most tourneys until the Elite Eight because of your high seeding. I'd also argue it's OVER-seeded because of how inflated your record is--and that's because of how weak the SEC is. LPT would certainly lose more games in the ACC.

With what LPT fans THOUGHT was the best team of all time, you struggled against the first good team (Notre Dame) you played in the tourney last year, and of course, you lost to Wisconsin which was itself beaten in the final. Those games weren't flukes. Your team wasn't that good relative to the other teams at that point. Competitive, but not clearly better--far from it. And you didn't know that until late in the postseason. Is that lack of preparedness? I don't know what to call it.

This year, you were disappointed losing to IU. Same experience, just at an earlier point in the tourney. And the couple of other SEC teams in the tourney have looked as bad/disappointing. It's a function IMO of an inflated perception that SEC teams get playing so many games against each other, most being subpar competition.

The SEC isn't doing your team and your program any favors. It's tough for LPT fans to admit that with your history in that conference. But that ancient caveman stuff don't mean ish in 2016. My belief is that you will lower the bar for excellence and rationalize disappointing results, or if you're making an honest assessment, continue to be disappointed.

"Elite program", my a$$...
 
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zipp said:
You have the better perspective on your own team as far as the regular season. I probably don't watch 40 minutes of your team for five months, but I do watch the postseason.

Where I would disagree is your assessment of the how well LPT is prepared. I'd argue that LPT isn't seriously tested in most tourneys until the Elite Eight because of your high seeding. I'd also argue it's OVER-seeded because of how inflated your record is--and that's because of how weak the SEC is. LPT would certainly lose more games in the ACC.

With what LPT fans THOUGHT was the best team of all time, you struggled against the first good team (Notre Dame) you played in the tourney last year, and of course, you lost to Wisconsin which was itself beaten in the final. Those games weren't flukes. Your team wasn't that good relative to the other teams at that point. Competitive, but not clearly better--far from it. And you didn't know that until late in the postseason. Is that lack of preparedness? I don't know what to call it.

This year, you were disappointed losing to IU. Same experience, just at an earlier point in the tourney. And the couple of other SEC teams in the tourney have looked as bad/disappointing. It's a function IMO of an inflated perception that SEC teams get playing so many games against each other, most being subpar competition.

The SEC isn't doing your team and your program any favors. It's tough for LPT fans to admit that with your history in that conference. But that ancient caveman stuff don't mean ish in 2016. My belief is that you will lower the bar for excellence and rationalize disappointing results, or if you're making an honest assessment, continue to be disappointed.

"Elite program", my a$$...
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I feel like it's a circular argument zipp - can't really figure out what you're saying;

  • UK would have more titles if it played in a better conference due to being more prepared, or
  • UK would have less titles playing in a better conference because even though they might be better prepared, they'd have a worse seed, or
  • UK's 3 titles in the last 20 years are about right regardless of conference, or
  • etc
  • etc
I moved to Lexington in early 1996 so if we use that as the starting point for my fandom, it's hard to be disappointed. There are by your standards somewhere north of 100 teams playing in better conferences than UK is, however, exactly 1 of those schools have managed to win more titles than UK in that time frame. Many "blue bloods" have done little to nothing in that time frame. Titles are hard to win. If we never get another in my lifetime, I'll have been fortunate enough to have witnessed more of them than 99% of the rest of D1 teams. Compare that to my Leafs, that haven't even been to a Stanley Cup final since 1967, and it seems awfully good :)
 
Bill Derington said:
I didn't mean the ACC was going to kick Louisville out. I meant that Tobacco Rd rules the conference, and they're going to protect UNC at all cost.
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Chances are Louisville will find it's own natural level in the ACC and be in the race for the conference leadership every single season. It might behoove you to check the results of our placement in the Big East over time. In fact, for, I believe, a 5 year period, no one won more ballgames in the entire country than UofL - even out of that conference.ism

The Big East was dominated by basketball-only schools, another favoritism of a similar sort. UNC's protectionism is boring and old. Just watch, like we know you will.
 
Senore2006 said:
Chances are Louisville will find it's own natural level in the ACC and be in the race for the conference leadership every single season. It might behoove you to check the results of our placement in the Big East over time. In fact, for, I believe, a 5 year period, no one won more ballgames in the entire country than UofL - even out of that conference.ism

The Big East was dominated by basketball-only schools, another favoritism of a similar sort. UNC's protectionism is boring and old. Just watch, like we know you will.
Click to expand...

I wasn't speaking of wins and losses in ballgames.
 
JohnKBA said:
I feel like it's a circular argument zipp - can't really figure out what you're saying;

  • UK would have more titles if it played in a better conference due to being more prepared, or
  • UK would have less titles playing in a better conference because even though they might be better prepared, they'd have a worse seed, or
  • UK's 3 titles in the last 20 years are about right regardless of conference, or
  • etc
  • etc
I moved to Lexington in early 1996 so if we use that as the starting point for my fandom, it's hard to be disappointed. There are by your standards somewhere north of 100 teams playing in better conferences than UK is, however, exactly 1 of those schools have managed to win more titles than UK in that time frame. Many "blue bloods" have done little to nothing in that time frame. Titles are hard to win. If we never get another in my lifetime, I'll have been fortunate enough to have witnessed more of them than 99% of the rest of D1 teams. Compare that to my Leafs, that haven't even been to a Stanley Cup final since 1967, and it seems awfully good.
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If LPT played in a better conference, you might be better at the end of the year. Obviously, we can't know for sure. It depends on how much you learn and improve from losses and tough games. Or you might simply have a more realistic view of how good you are. Even if you don't improve, you'll at least have that.

I think LPT's postseason results under Pitino Lite are largely explained by two factors:
  • Anthony Davis
  • Overseeding
You've had one clear franchise player that just about any Top 50 team would win with. And you did. Most of the other years, you were basically seeded into the Final Four which LPT fans now point to since Pitino Lite usually falls short. And in NO years did you win with less talent; in fact, you always have more talent than your opposition, usually much more.

Your conference has nothing to do with the make-up of your team or its coach. But you really can't play against SEC competition for two months and call that preparing yourself for the NCAA tourney when you have such a vast difference in the quality of teams you're facing. Staying in the SEC, you'd be better off doing what U of L used to do 30 years ago in a weak conference... Play your conference games during the week and schedule at-large, high quality teams on the weekend on national TV. Of course, those other teams would have to accommodate you which may not be possible.

"Elite program", my a$$...
 
Zipp, I gotta give it you man, it takes diligence and skill to spin the way you can. I don't mean that as a slight either.
 
zipp said:
If LPT played in a better conference, you might be better at the end of the year. Obviously, we can't know for sure. It depends on how much you learn and improve from losses and tough games. Or you might simply have a more realistic view of how good you are. Even if you don't improve, you'll at least have that.

I think LPT's postseason results under Pitino Lite are largely explained by two factors:
  • Anthony Davis
  • Overseeding
You've had one clear franchise player that just about any Top 50 team would win with. And you did. Most of the other years, you were basically seeded into the Final Four which LPT fans now point to since Pitino Lite usually falls short. And in NO years did you win with less talent; in fact, you always have more talent than your opposition, usually much more.

Your conference has nothing to do with the make-up of your team or its coach. But you really can't play against SEC competition for two months and call that preparing yourself for the NCAA tourney when you have such a vast difference in the quality of teams you're facing. Staying in the SEC, you'd be better off doing what U of L used to do 30 years ago in a weak conference... Play your conference games during the week and schedule at-large, high quality teams on the weekend on national TV. Of course, those other teams would have to accommodate you which may not be possible.

"Elite program", my a$$...
Click to expand...

I'll just ask a couple of follow ups since I don't have lots of time - do you think we were overseeded in 2011? How about 2014? Both of those teams were freshman laden, played mediocre schedules, lost a bunch of road games and went into the tourney as a 4 seed and an 8 seed, and parlayed that into a 9-2 record those 2 years, knocking off teams that had much better regular seasons, had much more experienced talent, and played in better conferences. Just food for thought. I'm pretty sure I know how you'll answer, but I've been known to be wrong once a year or so :D
 
JohnKBA said:
I'll just ask a couple of follow ups since I don't have lots of time - do you think we were overseeded in 2011? How about 2014? Both of those teams were freshman laden, played mediocre schedules, lost a bunch of road games and went into the tourney as a 4 seed and an 8 seed, and parlayed that into a 9-2 record those 2 years, knocking off teams that had much better regular seasons, had much more experienced talent, and played in better conferences. Just food for thought. I'm pretty sure I know how you'll answer, but I've been known to be wrong once a year or so...
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Yeah, unlike your brethren, you've got me figured out pretty well... :cool:

An example or two can show anything, but it's about probability as most things are. Since Pitino Lite's arrival, LPT has been seeded #1 three times in the NCAA, #4 twice, and #8 once. That's an average seed of about 3. And if you remove the #8 outlier, the average seeding was close to 2. You look at the Final Fours from 2010-2015, the average seed of those teams was 3.92. So, in the average year, LPT has a higher probability than most of the better teams in the country of making the Final Four based on seeding alone. If your average seed was around four, you'd be performing--making the Final Four--in line with your seeding. Better seeded, you're potentially underperforming; lower seeded, you're for sure outperforming.

It's also about what you do when you get there. LPT should have made three Final Fours based on seeding alone--it took upsets to knock you out. IMO it's no mystery that the only year LPT won its last two games was with AD. Even some of your more critical fans are starting to question the lack of championships with the talent LPT usually has.

It may be easier for an inexperienced but talented freshman to get a false sense of security playing inferior competition. More experienced players recognize otherwise. Maybe an interaction of issues with OAD players playing a weak schedule. That's an LPT thingy again.

"Elite program", my a$$...
 
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teamcanada said:
I remember last spring and summer Bill preaching to us about how the football gap between the two schools has closed.
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Isn't that what most UK fans say and think this time of year? The coach gets them pumped up about spring practice, then they go into the summer thinking "maybe we're an average, competitive team this year. An average, competitive team might beat [x] team."

Gone are thoughts of under-performing Elam, the mass exodus at the QB position, and coaching masterpieces such as UK at Vandy and 8 men on the field for a punt return.

Someone could just post that UK calendar one more time... it's the most visual representation of the behavior of their football fans I've ever seen.
 
Senore2006 said:
LOL, no you don't. You repeat conventional wisdoms, distilled from a barely literate fan base.
Click to expand...

What have I repeated from a fanbase?
This very thread started from a bs post that I responded too did it not?
Maybe if everyone is repeating something it's because it's true.

For a writer you sure do speak in sweeping generalizations.
 
teamcanada said:
I remember last spring and summer Bill preaching to us about how the football gap between the two schools has closed.
Click to expand...

I still think the 2 programs are close. Last years game changed when Boom Williams went down, much like it did for Louisville Jackson came in.
UK couldn't stop Jackson, Louisville couldn't stop Boom.
The fact of the matter is Louisvilles wins have been in a steady decline.
I stated last Summer on here that UK would go as far as Towles could take them, and I wasn't sure he had what it took between the ears. I was hopeful that he would grow as QB mentally, because he has the tools physically. He didn't, and Stoops stayed with him too long in my opinion.
 
Bill Derington said:
I still think the 2 programs are close. Last years game changed when Boom Williams went down, much like it did for Louisville Jackson came in.
UK couldn't stop Jackson, Louisville couldn't stop Boom.
The fact of the matter is Louisvilles wins have been in a steady decline.
I stated last Summer on here that UK would go as far as Towles could take them, and I wasn't sure he had what it took between the ears. I was hopeful that he would grow as QB mentally, because he has the tools physically. He didn't, and Stoops stayed with him too long in my opinion.
Click to expand...
We gift wrapped you guys a 21-0 lead, and we still won by two td's. o_O
 
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Bill Derington said:
I still think the 2 programs are close. Last years game changed when Boom Williams went down, much like it did for Louisville Jackson came in.
UK couldn't stop Jackson, Louisville couldn't stop Boom.
The fact of the matter is Louisvilles wins have been in a steady decline.
I stated last Summer on here that UK would go as far as Towles could take them, and I wasn't sure he had what it took between the ears. I was hopeful that he would grow as QB mentally, because he has the tools physically. He didn't, and Stoops stayed with him too long in my opinion.
Click to expand...
And in 2014 you were just a dropped interception from winning that game too- right? Stoops is in the Kragthorpe class of coaching. You get on here and repeat the Matt Jones line like most of the other blue fans. Any fan base who uses Tards as a name for thier rivals are either idiots or are to stupid to be considered idiots.
 
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