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We give Jeff another year. That’s all.

LeFors4Ever
Jeff needs to change, but I'd also say "Who else?"

A 35 year old Will Stein isn't a savior. We know what Jeff can do in the right circumstance, but anyone else could be a risk.

We could get someone like a Krag or a Satterfield again. Charlie Strong? I mean Charlie could work, but remember Charlie never coached in a P5 league. We wouldn't have made a bowl his first 2 years had we been in the ACC under Charlie and wouldn't have been sniffing a BCS bowl or ranked in 2012 either. Would we have been as patient with Charlie to build the momentum for 2013?

I said with Satt and I'll say with Jeff too, we have to define our expectations. We fire Jeff and we can't just expect a big turnaround and go back to Bobby 1.0 or Charlie in the Big East and AAC. We are playing tougher teams than we ever have before in our history. Saturday's loss is inexcusable, but talking about firing him?

I just ask, who is this guy who will come in and be way better? We aren't a destination school for HCs. We've only hired mid major and coordinators before this who are on their way up, Jeff wanted to be here and he's the first proven guy since Howard who also wanted to be here.

Because we can't compare the program to 2004--2006 or 2010-2013. It's a new age. Not to mention, the SEC and Big Ten have such financial advantages in terms of coaching and staff salaries that will make it even harder here.
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Indiana

LeFors4Ever
TheRealVille said:
IU's 2 point win over Michigan? A Michigan team that lost by 20 to Washington.

We can do this dance all day. Currently, not one single team IU has beaten is bowl eligible. Some undoubtedly will win a 6th game, but IU should not sniff the playoff unless they beat OSU.
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Teams in the #5 through #13 spots in the Big 10 all have 3 and 4 wins. A lot of the Big Ten's issue is their middle teams are beating up on each other and you have 4 teams flat out dominating and separating. A lot of above average and good, but not a lot of great. They have been fortunate to have missed out on Oregon and Penn State, but they'll still play Ohio State.

It's not a great schedule at all, but they're beating quality teams. I don't put too much stock into rankings and such, because it's really based on record and where you were in the preseason. Go look at most years, Ohio State/Michigan will play each other plus Penn State and the rest of their schedule isn't scary in terms of record and rankings. But they're good teams. And their resumes never get picked apart like IU's had.

I don't think IU is some amazing team, but I'd also say look at Miami, SMU, and Clemson at the top of our league. They've gotten a pretty easy ride for most of their schedule.

You can only beat the teams in front of you. IU has handled the teams they should. They survived the close one against Michigan to pick up a quality win. I'm not saying they're great, but they have as good a case as anyone. In this new era, no one can really cry. The system generally should make sure the top 5 teams get in and everyone else is just filler.
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We give Jeff another year. That’s all.

nccardfan
Ipartiedwithhopgood said:
My reference to city college isn't about feels, it's about what is on the roster and who your HC and staff are, and what kind of $ players and staff make which does have a direct impact on the outcome of all the games, not just the games where we like the results.

We can't miss on players we spend on. Lacy is a massive fail for this program. Fans say next man up. You lost your slot WR before you even lost Lacy. There's only so much $ to go around to hit depth.

That $ spent on Lacy could have been allotted to the defensive side of the ball on a player (s) that give you more than a few games. We don't have the resources to recover from a swing and miss like that. We like our QB but the guy literally can't run for first downs.

tOSU is tied with NW halfway through the 2nd Q. They are playing like hot garbage. They score 0 in the 1st Q with NFL guys up and down their roster against effing Northwestern.

But they have the talent to ultimately pivot out of that and win easily. We can't do that. We couldn't against Virginia, BC, or Stanford. So Saturday isn't an anomaly, it's part of what we are and who we have. A team that can beat some decent teams but also lose and/or struggle vs bad teams. It's more about your resources and less about "coach bad".

UofL Sugar Bowl arguably best ever team lost to Syracuse and UCONN. Keep in mind that Sugar Bowl is not part of the modern era anymore. We're in a new world where BYU is offering the #1 BB player millions. Meanwhile, we're signing Vanilla Ice who I really like, from USF.

If Brohm's giving you a trend of 6-8 win seasons like Satt you turn the page. But he won 10 year one and put you in the only ACCT game you've ever played in. No perspective. It's just ridiculous to be coming after him how some people are. He wants to be here, and none of your prior coaches wanted to be here.

But it's okay to agree to disagree.
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First, you make it sound like Lacy was a program issue when in fact it could be just an individual issue. Just because they sign up to play for U of L doesn't mean they don't have flaws. We don't really personally know these kids even when they're here 3 or 4 years (I know thats true about Terrence Williams).

Secondly, some pundits will say that Brohm's first year back was the anomaly. No Clemson and no FSU on the schedule. Yes, we beat a 10th rank ND, ranked Duke team and a subpar Miami team but ended up with a 3 game losing streak.

For the record, not advocating for firing Jeff, but want to see some real changes made, not cosmetic ones.
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Indiana

TheRealVille
LeFors4Ever said:
Like with us last year, when other teams aren't performing and you are, that means you are the good team.
They're in a power league with a lot of talent. They are winning.

It's always "Michigan, Michigan State, and Washington are soooo down!" and when those teams are good and IU is bad, it's never about how Michigan has only played a team like IU and make it about IU being down.

If IU was getting lucky and such, I'd say they weren't great and all. But they're winning big. Like beating Nebraska 56-7, not a world beating Nebraska team but they blew out a Colorado team that's getting playoff chatter at the moment. No one else on Nebraska's schedule beat them that bad other than IU.

I hate IU for cancelling, but a lot of the Anti-IU talking points our own fans are hyping up are the same ones that will be used against us some day when we're in the running for a playoff spot.
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IU's 2 point win over Michigan? A Michigan team that lost by 20 to Washington.

We can do this dance all day. Currently, not one single team IU has beaten is bowl eligible. Some undoubtedly will win a 6th game, but IU should not sniff the playoff unless they beat OSU.
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We give Jeff another year. That’s all.

CardX
Ipartiedwithhopgood said:
My reference to city college isn't about feels, it's about what is on the roster and who your HC and staff are, and what kind of $ players and staff make which does have a direct impact on the outcome of all the games, not just the games where we like the results.

We can't miss on players we spend on. Lacy is a massive fail for this program. Fans say next man up. You lost your slot WR before you even lost Lacy. There's only so much $ to go around to hit depth.

That $ spent on Lacy could have been allotted to the defensive side of the ball on a player (s) that give you more than a few games. We don't have the resources to recover from a swing and miss like that. We like our QB but the guy literally can't run for first downs.

tOSU is tied with NW halfway through the 2nd Q. They are playing like hot garbage. They score 0 in the 1st Q with NFL guys up and down their roster against effing Northwestern.

But they have the talent to ultimately pivot out of that and win easily. We can't do that. We couldn't against Virginia, BC, or Stanford. So Saturday isn't an anomaly, it's part of what we are and who we have. A team that can beat some decent teams but also lose and/or struggle vs bad teams. It's more about your resources and less about "coach bad".

UofL Sugar Bowl arguably best ever team lost to Syracuse and UCONN. Keep in mind that Sugar Bowl is not part of the modern era anymore. We're in a new world where BYU is offering the #1 BB player millions. Meanwhile, we're signing Vanilla Ice who I really like, from USF.

If Brohm's giving you a trend of 6-8 win seasons like Satt you turn the page. But he won 10 year one and put you in the only ACCT game you've ever played in. No perspective. It's just ridiculous to be coming after him how some people are. He wants to be here, and none of your prior coaches wanted to be here.

But it's okay to agree to disagree.
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The Stanford loss wasn't a talent issue. Brohm failed to properly prepare his team, which, he took all the blame. I'm not expecting undefeated seasons. I'm expecting sustaining momentum. There was very real positive momentum heading into the Stanford game. Brohm blew it.

UofL football isn't the only sport where we're at a disadvantage from a NIL perspective. Walz has a $500K NIL budget. He just took an L to UK. Their NIL budget for women's basketball: $1.3M. So, while that sucks, it's not fair, I'm not going to turn my fan card in and find a new hobby because the landscape has changed. Feel free, though.

The UofL Sugar Bowl team isn't arguably the best team ever. There have been many great teams. However, beating Florida in the Sugar is undoubtedly one of the program's finest wins. The two losses you refer to, which, I'm not sure why that's relevant, Teddy was banged up big time in the UCONN game. He got knocked out of the game twice, which then led to his legendary and heroic performance at Rutgers the following week, that clinched a BCS bid.
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We give Jeff another year. That’s all.

LeFors4Ever
bigloucards said:
I know it’s besides the point, but UofL only lost 1 game the year they won the Sugar Bowl (UCF)
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You're likely confused, we won the Russell Athletic Bowl in 2013, which was the year we lost 1 game to UCF.

In 2012, we lost 2 games and honestly had some pretty bad performances against some bad teams. UConn and Cuse were losses. And some way to close for comfort wins against some bad teams like FIU, Southern Miss, and USF. That team really just hit another gear in the month before the Sugar Bowl, because that team in the regular season wasn't that dominant. The Sugar Bowl team that took the field was great, but the full 2012 season wasn't our best team at all.
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We give Jeff another year. That’s all.

LeFors4Ever
CardsDan said:
Fickel just fired his OC after Wisconsin's loss Saturday. Norvell has fired DC and OC. I'd like to see a little bravery from JB to pull the trigger and get rid of English today. Not being able to protect a 15 point lead with less than 10 minutes left in the game without any turnovers should be a very fireable action.
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As I've put in another thread, the issue is a lot of the same with how Bobby ran his teams. Jeff is a HC that's fully focused on calling plays and running the offense. If he's focused on offense, the defense just isn't going to be his focus. He fully relies on his DC to make the calls and run the show.

His thought is that if he fires English, then you've fired the head coach of the defense. Jeff himself probably sees that he'd have to focus more on defense and it would add more work to his plate because no one on offense is running the show. He's not passing off work to Brian Brohm or McGee. I personally don't think firing English will change anything other than making the fans happier, but it likely won't lead to better results.

Mark Hagen would be the DC and he's been locked in with English since he was brought back to Purdue. This defensive staff are the people Ron English wants, so it will operate the same.

Fire him after the season is likely the smart move.
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Indiana

LeFors4Ever
TheRealVille said:
I think the thinking at IU was they were going to have a very difficult conference schedule with the above mentioned teams, so they wanted a fast start and playing a ranked non conference team so early in the schedule wasn't going to help that, so they canceled.

Of course in retrospect, that wasn't the right thing to do because there's no doubt they would have probably beaten Louisville, and those tough conference teams happened to be not so tough.

Which after Saturday, Louisville can be included as a not so tough opponent and beating the Cards would not have helped them get in if they lose to OSU.
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Like with us last year, when other teams aren't performing and you are, that means you are the good team.
They're in a power league with a lot of talent. They are winning.

It's always "Michigan, Michigan State, and Washington are soooo down!" and when those teams are good and IU is bad, it's never about how Michigan has only played a team like IU and make it about IU being down.

If IU was getting lucky and such, I'd say they weren't great and all. But they're winning big. Like beating Nebraska 56-7, not a world beating Nebraska team but they blew out a Colorado team that's getting playoff chatter at the moment. No one else on Nebraska's schedule beat them that bad other than IU.

I hate IU for cancelling, but a lot of the Anti-IU talking points our own fans are hyping up are the same ones that will be used against us some day when we're in the running for a playoff spot.
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We give Jeff another year. That’s all.

T
We are discussing big picture not why they lost to Stanford. The thread is discussing firing Brohm next year which is fine. Some of us are pointing out acquiring talent is a huge challenge for Louisville. The limited talent exposing all these teams to losses. Unless the new guy can recruit unlike anyone else to walk that sideline we will be replacing him sooner than later.

Stanford specific how can you watch what their receivers did against our best cover corner and say Riley was more talented. In some ways I get the line of thinking from the staff my corners are good enough to cover their guys. Problem is your potential NFL corner was beat over and over again in single coverage. When key players have a bad game you can be beat by anyone.
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Indiana

TheRealVille
nccardfan said:
We might have known based on how the season ended up last year and may not have realized it. I argued and argued with friends that Jeff coming home to Louisville would be different than his "win some big games, lose some that you shouldn't" tendencies. Looks like I'm the one who's been wrong. Maybe having local ties and history doesn't mean a thing. You either can coach or you can't...

Can you tell I'm frustrated....
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You and me both. It's incredible to me that Brohm continues to get upset by inferior teams the game after he defeats a superior team. It can't be coincidence.

I believe it's him concentrating more as a OC during the game than he is a HC. He knows his history of losing these games, yet he apparently hasn't learned anything from it, and I believe it's because he's looking at it as a OC and how he will win this time because of successful play calling.

The Stanford game is a perfect example of a HC not being the HC during the game. Most of his energy was calling the plays and arguing about those called plays. It's a tendency that now can't be ignored and will have to be remedied soon if he's going to succeed here.
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We give Jeff another year. That’s all.

TheRealVille
I just don't buy this talent excuse for the Cards loss to Stanford or the other three games. I agree Louisville doesn't have national championship talent and may never have, but they are underachieving this season with the talent they do have.

The undisciplined play and behavior we saw against Stanford is clearly on the coaching staff and it's been there all season. Why hasn't Brohm put that shit to bed? I think it's because he's too busy trying to coordinate the offensive plays.

A couple of games ago Chris Bell had a very selfish personal foul penalty and should have been benched, but there he was, right back out there the next series.

The more games Louisville plays under Jeff Brohm the more it looks like him handling both the offensive duties and the HC duties is not working out like everyone wants. Talent or not, the HC has to have a hold on discipline and accountability.

Unfortunately, it took an embarrassing defeat at Stanford for many to realize it, including Brohm himself.
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We give Jeff another year. That’s all.

T
nccardfan said:
So is Ryan Day now a great coach because he's winning or is it because Harbaugh left to go to the NFL? Is Alabama the same great team or is it because Saban retired? Is Oregon suddenly great or is it because Harbaugh and Saban are not coaching anymore.
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Not sure but he is a great recruiter. He is closer to great than others because the talent he acquires. I do know Ryan Day at Louisville would be no different than Brohm if he had the same talent as Louisville. I am not sold he would recruit that much better. Now Sanders is a fascinating study. No one thinks he is staying at Colorado. As soon as he leaves watch than ship sink.

I think if Brohm moves on DC wise he has to land dynamic recruiters at every position. His offense recruits itself. Defensive staff needs recruiters. May have to take a risk in a young SEC position coach that is a terrific recruiter or a DC that had strong recruiting and coaching relationships.
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Indiana

nccardfan
Rollem Cards said:
This team, early season or late season, wants no part of IU.

if they hadn’t backed out we would have known what we know now a lot sooner.
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We might have known based on how the season ended up last year and may not have realized it. I argued and argued with friends that Jeff coming home to Louisville would be different than his "win some big games, lose some that you shouldn't" tendencies. Looks like I'm the one who's been wrong. Maybe having local ties and history doesn't mean a thing. You either can coach or you can't...

Can you tell I'm frustrated....
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We give Jeff another year. That’s all.

nccardfan
CardsDan said:
Fickel just fired his OC after Wisconsin's loss Saturday. Norvell has fired DC and OC. I'd like to see a little bravery from JB to pull the trigger and get rid of English today. Not being able to protect a 15 point lead with less than 10 minutes left in the game without any turnovers should be a very fireable action.
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I understand that sentiment but making changes at the DC was evident a few games ago. Before Brohm does it now, he had better look in the mirror first and ask himself "was it English's fault that I decided to go on 4th and 10" or why we kept chucking the ball deep... Yes, we came blame our defense but our HC deserves a lot of it himself and I think the coaching world knows that.
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