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Walz makes 7...

zipp

zipp

Elite Member
Jun 26, 2001
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...If he bolts, it would be SEVEN U of L coaching changes since the start of 2018.

Jurich replaced eight coaches between 1997 and 2004--the start of his tenure--including Cooper and Crum. Also recall we dodged a bullet with Dan McDonnell last year.

AKA another "coincidence"...
 
Cripple the Men’s program, destroy the Women’s program.

Leaves a big void to fill at KFC Yum! Center. NBA to Louisville talk starts back up.

Coincidence?
 
CommodoreCard said:
Cripple the Men’s program, destroy the Women’s program.

Leaves a big void to fill at KFC Yum! Center. NBA to Louisville talk starts back up.

Coincidence?
Click to expand...


Dont worry. The nba isnt coming to louisville. Thats a pipe dream
 
CardVille said:
Your 7 should not include Petrino or Pitino. Those were GTFO rather than leaving on their own.
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Pitino was gone before "Vince" took the job in 2017. However, "Vince" made the decision--or orchestrated it--to fire Petrino. He had options, and buying out Petrino was just one of them.

This isn't an exercise to rationalize data points unless one is an outlier. FOR WHATEVER REASON, we've had 8 situations in 14+ months that involve a coach leaving or being in play. That's more than one coach every other month, and about 40% of the head coaches employed by U of L.

Keep in mind that along with raising and generating money, retaining what was regarded as a blue chip collection of head coaches was a key performance indicator for "Vince". And one in which I was assured wouldn't be a problem...
 
zipp said:
Analyzing WHY things happen is important. And it has nothing to do with being a fan...
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I could care less about a "why" that I have no control of. I do not look to U of L sports for any kind of redeeming value or insight into how the world works. It is for entertainment purposes only.
 
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zipp said:
...If he bolts, it would be SEVEN U of L coaching changes since the start of 2018.

Jurich replaced eight coaches between 1997 and 2004--the start of his tenure--including Cooper and Crum. Also recall we dodged a bullet with Dan McDonnell last year.

AKA another "coincidence"...
Click to expand...

Coaches come and go. No biggie.
 
HiStepper said:
I could care less about a "why" that I have no control of. I do not look to U of L sports for any kind of redeeming value or insight into how the world works. It is for entertainment purposes only.
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The issue for many of us is it's also about money and, in some cases, a significant amount of it. You generally don't entrust money to people you don't trust, either from an integrity POV or competency.

That's the reason you need to understand "why" whether you can control a decision or not...
 
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zipp said:
The issue for many of us is it's also about money and, in some cases, a significant amount of it. You generally don't entrust money to people you don't trust, either from an integrity POV or competency.

That's the reason you need to understand "why" whether you can control a decision or not...
Click to expand...
The WHY does not influence me being a fan, It's the product. University politics do not concern me.
 
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HiStepper said:
The WHY does not influence me being a fan, It's the product. University politics do not concern me.
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Again, "fan" ain't the issue. You can be one without paying a dime.

And U of L athletics needs millions to support itself...
 
zipp said:
Again, "fan" ain't the issue. You can be one without paying a dime.

And U of L athletics needs millions to support itself...
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You may have a more inside position, association or knowledge of the money situation than many of us. If that is the case then I can certainly understand your concern.
 
I don't even want to hear any negative if Vince doesn't keep Walz. The guy hasnt won a championship and he is the top 4 or 5 paid coach at 1.48 mil with a one year salary buyout under contract tilll 2025 with added increases. So how much more do you want to pay their is a market value and Walz has maximized it give or take 100-200,000 for his results. Basically read this article closely.

https://www.knoxnews.com/story/spor...ff-walz-kara-lawson-kellie-harper/3066070002/
 
REDFISTFURY3 said:
I don't even want to hear any negative if Vince doesn't keep Walz. The guy hasnt won a championship and he is the top 4 or 5 paid coach at 1.48 mil with a one year salary buyout under contract tilll 2025 with added increases. So how much more do you want to pay their is a market value and Walz has maximized it give or take 100-200,000 for his results. Basically read this article closely.

https://www.knoxnews.com/story/spor...ff-walz-kara-lawson-kellie-harper/3066070002/
Click to expand...
As best I can tell, Jeff's base salary is no more than $1.2 million. Any salary comparison should be apples to apples. Base salary is guaranteed money.

You sure will hear plenty of fallout if money becomes the issue, and Walz is paid 20-40% less than his peers. That's not how U of L compensates its coaches, or at least it hasn't been. If it's changed, that change happened recently.

And this tough talk about controlling costs is simply a chicken-and-egg situation. "Vince" ain't reining in money because he thinks it's right to do. Simply put, he doesn't have the money--and you should be asking "why?" (I already know the answer...)
 
The women's program loses money to the tune of $3 million a year. If Walz wants to leave, the fiscally responsible thing to do is to let him.

This is not to say that you should only invest in the two revenue generating sports, but rather you can only go so far with the non-revenue sports.
 
pitino was fired for running a program that became a national embarassment and was hired by TJ so good riddance
petrino was hired by TJ and ran the program into the ground, didn't recruit at all locally, and hired family members with no experience, was abrasive, a douchebag and his hiring was a stain on the program to start and all on Tj's shoulders. so that's two coaches who should have been gone.
next is lolla, he peeked in 2013 and his teams underachieved since then. was time to move on as he was not producing. hired by TJ, not producing anymore like before, so gone on his own terms as he realized his time had passed.
and who are the other 4, people who loved TJ, who cares?
McDonnell is still here. Walz is still here. Seems to Me Vince is doing about 100% correct. TJ Ran this program into a national embarrassment, lest we forget, now you basically rid all remnants of his regime and move on. GET OVER IT ZIPP!!! maybe all of TJ coaches should have been fired and Vince is simply deciding who was worth keeping. your guy, TJ, was the head of the program as we became the laughing stock of all sports. simply admit it, TJ fans are ruining the program because they are the ones not donating for selfish reasons, complaining non stop (ZIPP) and they are the ones not showing up to games. ponder that as we move forward with Vince
 
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TJ did some things wrong and it is hard to defend him for the few mistakes he made. However he never should have been fired for them mainly because he bought in a boat load of money. When you go to a basketball game, baseball game, football game, soccer game, etc., that is because of TJ. It is not TJ's fault or anybody who supported him fault that Vince can't raise the same amount of money TJ did.
 
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KozmasAgain said:
TJ did some things wrong and it is hard to defend him for the few mistakes he made. However he never should have been fired for them mainly because he bought in a boat load of money. When you go to a basketball game, baseball game, football game, soccer game, etc., that is because of TJ. It is not TJ's fault or anybody who supported him fault that Vince can't raise the same amount of money TJ did.
Click to expand...

It depends on why the program isn't raising the money it did before. You can look at it in a vacuum and say TJ did this and Tyra did this but it can't be totally discounted that Tyra is paying for some of TJ's mistakes. There is no way that the 2 bball scandals didn't have an effect on the fans and what they were willing to do with their money.
 
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The money not coming in has nothing to do with the problems created under Pitino or Petrino. If that was the case the money would have started to pour in once they were fired. It is pretty well known that the donors who donated money to Jurich aren't donating the money anymore.
Now it is up to Vince to go out and find new donors the same way TJ did when he came in. I think a good way to start mending fences is to get rid of Grissom. He is not well liked by the former big donors so I would get rid of him.
 
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KozmasAgain said:
The money not coming in has nothing to do with the problems created under Pitino or Petrino. If that was the case the money would have started to pour in once they were fired. It is pretty well known that the donors who donated money to Jurich aren't donating the money anymore.
Now it is up to Vince to go out and find new donors the same way TJ did when he came in. I think a good way to start mending fences is to get rid of Grissom. He is not well liked by the former big donors so I would get rid of him.
Click to expand...

i don't think it works that way. With all the hurt feelings, people taking sides, and all around drama the program and university as a whole went through, I don't think that everyone just immediately comes back. I think that there are a lot of people who want to see stability and success before coming back. We are still facing the possibility of sanctions from the last scandal.

This current season is the first that we really got to see the affect. The football season had already started and the bball season was a couple of weeks away by the time that news hit of the the fbi scandal the year before. This year was the 1st that fans had to make the choice knowing what all was happening. Add in a team that was supposed to not be very good and you see lower attendance.

I do agree that Grissom needs to go though. He doesn't really care about athletics or UofL and his departure would be one the last people to go involved on either side of the drama.
 
I think it would be worth “letting the cake bake” concerning Walz’s future at his point. Let’s see what happens before returning to the giddiness at the start of this thread.

Also, it’s worth considering that most people that follow the specific sports closely don’t have any problem with 3 of the previous 6 coaching changes referenced in this thread – 1) Pitino/Padgett (Pitino absolutely had to go, and that was before Tyra, and as much as I liked Padgett and appreciated what he did, the outcry from most posters here if he had been retained would have been deafening, as in “I knew they were gonna go cheap, they are deemphasizing athletics”), 2) Petrino (the deterioration in performance and culture and effort), and 3) Kellie Young (lacrosse coach was abusing players). To simply cite the coaching changes as “data points” without any analysis is just lazy and clearly agenda-driven.

And perhaps the difference in the coaching changes between Jurich and Tyra early in their tenures is also partly a reflection of some of the hires of the AD that preceded each of them… Bill Olsen never hired a Kellie Young or a Petrino, and at least in the case of Pitino, a reflection of the AD being unable to rein in the basketball program.
 
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KozmasAgain said:
… When you go to a basketball game, baseball game, football game, soccer game, etc., that is because of TJ...
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Maybe you didn’t mean it exactly the way that this came out, but no…

TJ is not the reason I attend basketball games, football games, etc. I began attending UofL football and basketball consistently in the 70’s and became a season-ticket holder for both sports in the early 80’s. I attend several volleyball games each year because my daughter loves the sport, and I became a soccer fan when I played in high school and that continues to this day. Well, maybe Jurich is pretty much the reason that I attend UofL baseball in addition to Bats/Redbirds which I attended exclusively before McDonnell came along.

Jurich is responsible for a great many positive things at UofL, including a lot of great facilities and the upgrade to the ACC, but I was a fan way before he came here and I’ll be a fan for many years to come (I hope).
 
BPGhost said:
That’s an interesting take. Not disputing it mind you but, could you provide some additional insight / details on how you came to this conclusion?
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It’s because he isn’t complicit with cheating to win. And coaches know that’s crippling in NCAA. TJ looked the other way time and time again in men’s bb and football and Tyra has made it clear he values a program ran the right way over a win at all costs program. Mack and Satterfield run clean programs that are built on discipline and doing things the right way. The new crop of coaches may need time to build success but it is better in the long run.
 
We could pull a Tennessee, they fired Phil Fulmer and watched their program decline so they hired him back. We could hire Jurich back and watch the money roll in.
 
When I said when you go to an athletic event and see what Jurich built I was talking about the top notch facilities.
 
gocards1987 said:
It depends on why the program isn't raising the money it did before. You can look at it in a vacuum and say TJ did this and Tyra did this but it can't be totally discounted that Tyra is paying for some of TJ's mistakes. There is no way that the 2 bball scandals didn't have an effect on the fans and what they were willing to do with their money.
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And there are no fans that I can find who stay away from basketball games because of the PRIOR regime. That's simply a narrative unsupported by actual evidence...
 
KozmasAgain said:
The money not coming in has nothing to do with the problems created under Pitino or Petrino. If that was the case the money would have started to pour in once they were fired. It is pretty well known that the donors who donated money to Jurich aren't donating the money anymore...
Click to expand...
Precisely.
KozmasAgain said:
...Now it is up to Vince to go out and find new donors the same way TJ did when he came in. I think a good way to start mending fences is to get rid of Grissom. He is not well liked by the former big donors so I would get rid of him.
Click to expand...
The problem is there isn't new money and donors. Anyone who watched Ramsey and the Juriches operate know they milked those cows dry. They were outstanding fund raisers, and the only question is/was how far down fund raising would fall without those guys.

Also, the all-Grissom's-fault notion is an oversimplification of a much more complex problem...
 
Art79 said:
...To simply cite the coaching changes as “data points” without any analysis is just lazy and clearly agenda-driven...
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Just curious, should I similarly remove the Cooper and Crum dismissals from the Jurich database since it was so obvious that those guys had to go? That gets Jurich to almost a decade before he sees the coaching attrition under "Vince".

Not sure about you, but I like driving on two-way streets.
Art79 said:
...Bill Olsen never hired a Kellie Young or a Petrino, and at least in the case of Pitino, a reflection of the AD being unable to rein in the basketball program.
Click to expand...
Football coaches and strippers at golf outings must have been approved in the mid-90s employee policy manual. This was before Twitter and social media.

Short memories...
 
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Cardinal Cash said:
It’s because he isn’t complicit with cheating to win. And coaches know that’s crippling in NCAA. TJ looked the other way time and time again in men’s bb and football and Tyra has made it clear he values a program ran the right way over a win at all costs program. Mack and Satterfield run clean programs that are built on discipline and doing things the right way. The new crop of coaches may need time to build success but it is better in the long run.
Click to expand...
But it's OK to for your side business (Louisville FC) to lease university property (Lynn Stadium), and for your Realtor-daughter to personally profit from university employee recruitment (football coaches).

And closer to home, let's continue to play a kid named in a pay-for-play hearing (VJ King).

The problem with that moral high ground is everyone can see your a$$ when your trousers fall down.
Cardinal Cash said:
Who should we hire as AD Zipp?
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I'd start looking at candidates with legit AD credentials, not fanboys who tout transferable skills...
 
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