What sanctions have Creighton and Kansas endured prior to what's pending?
The process is nearing completion...
- Thread starter zipp
- Start date
- Status
[QUOTE="zipp, post: 669444, member: 1
So as far as resources and comparative examples, why should my standards for this team be any lower than it is? I don't understand it, hence this thread...
[/QUOTE]
There are arent any comparable examples to this mess.
Hookers + FBI is just not an everybody else did is doing it way of operating.
So as far as resources and comparative examples, why should my standards for this team be any lower than it is? I don't understand it, hence this thread...
[/QUOTE]
There are arent any comparable examples to this mess.
Hookers + FBI is just not an everybody else did is doing it way of operating.
I wasn’t happy about the loss to UK in ‘86. But if you remember we won a national title that year. Check out the dates on the banners at YUM Center. So, I kinda got over it. Some folks don’t seem to be able to let things go and move on.
Last edited:
12-1 was their preseason odds as of 11-25-2020, That was six games and less than one month ago.
I just quoted you a pretty obvious, nearby example of how wrong Vegas can be looking out a half dozen games or so. Instead of hurling insults, bring more conclusive evidence to make your case otherwise...
My comparison was WRT to your "looming" observation.
As far as actual sanctions, they're irrelevant if it hasn't affected your current roster of players and coaches. You think Mack is a good coach, and I just presented you an up-to-date analysis of your roster talent.
You can have reduced expectations if you want. Just don't try to ground them in factual info about your team and other teams...
Plenty of bad ish going on elsewhere, some worse than ours. The DIFFERENCE is no one else laid waste to their basketball program to achieve whatever ends the current regime is shooting for.
Sorry I don't give anyone much sympathy for self-inflicted injuries. Nor evidently do a lot of other fans I see and talk to...
Wrong, actual sanctions cost the program players - like Ramey @ Texas for example.
I don't follow recruiting as close as others but I'm sure there are countless other high profile guys that removed UofL from their list due to these off-court problems that you *shrug* about.
The current roster of players wouldn't be if not for sanctions LOL!!!!!!!!!
You're still not on the topic of the thread. And you need to start another thread if you wanna change it...
Baylor covered up a murder about 20 years ago I guess.
Please list all the programs in bed with hookers and the FBI in a short window that's the analysis we need here.
You continue to short change what's happened here it's just mind numbing LOL!
I'm not wrong about that analysis. You lose a good player, you bring in another.
The Slazinski (sp?) kid is Rivals three star, and Williamson is five. Every other kid on the roster we signed outta high school is four stars. Even Pitino didn't exceed that level of recruiting.
If Mack isn't winning or looking good doing so with these guys, that's on him. Blaming NCAA sanctions is a red herring when there's nothing wrong with your recruiting except the results...
How about schools where there's hard evidence that current coaches are (or were) violating rules? Why doesn't that affect them now like you claim we're being affected?
Because your premise is flawed...
My anecdotal evidence was the cherry on top, and it's still evidence. It just doesn't jive with your way of looking at the world. Not my fault...
No, I understand the thread completely. I just disagree there is some sinister plan to destroy U of L athletics from within because we lost a game in December.
I agree we lost big time. Don’t believe it is part of a higher plan regardless of what a small circle of lunatics are trying to sell.
I agree we lost big time. Don’t believe it is part of a higher plan regardless of what a small circle of lunatics are trying to sell.
List your examples of coaches in year 3ish that inherited programs that got sanctioned for hookers and have sanctions pending for the FBI.
The team was still getting a 2 seed per final bracket drop. 21% of Final Four teams come from the 2 line in the history of the tournament since they started seeding in 1979.
Obviously, the 2nd most popular seed to reach the Final Four.
NCAA Final Four Appearances by Seed
I wouldn’t call what I said an insult. You are being intellectually dishonest and you know it. You and I both know using Uk’s preseason odds to somehow discredit real time odds that took into account 30+ games is patently ridiculous. You are better than that.
My understanding of events is that UofL went on the road to play the at full strength 12th ranked team in the country with 8 scholarship players - and among those missing were 2 of their best 3 players. Wisconsin can shoot the 3 from all 5 spots, got hot and we got blown out. Is that somehow different than your understanding?
The whole notion of margin - it somehow would have been “better” getting beat by 20 - is silly. Regardless of how it makes you feel - it counts as one loss. I’ll reserve judgment on the team when we see how they perform at something resembling full strength. If at that point they are continuing to be non-competitive - I’ll agree there’s a problem.
And I can assure you that if bellarmine would have shown up with the same set of circumstances as did UofL - they would have been beaten by 80.
So you can assure me that ?(acting like you voice). I will see how it plays out too, but if playing at Wisconsin was a big enough deal to reschedule it, I’m surprised and unimpressed we would show up looking disorganized and uninterested. The big white kid isn’t Louisville material. Sure the board will have a field day with that, but he sucks. When was the last time we lost by 40? Not sure I have seen it and I was born in 1981 and started following closely in 1993
I can assure you that in the same way that you could promise me that they would have kept it at 20. I agree that it wasn’t a good look for UofL for a number of different reasons - I’m just not going place more importance on it than it deserves at this point in time.
The big white guy is a freshman who is only playing due to Williams injury, the utter cluelessness of Igiehon and apparently he works his ass if in practice and is vocal. I agree at this moment he doesn’t look like someone I would say will be a major factor at the 5 but, who knows - he might develop into a decent backup who plays defense and rebounds. If he doesn’t - he’ll be recruited over and it transfer.
Clearly the 40 point margin hurt your feelings but, you’re young - you’ll get over it.
I said nothing about such a "plan". I said there's an effort to short sell this team, downplay its shortcomings, and accept results that were previously unacceptable. You tell me if that fits into your plan...
You're simply asking for an exact analog to what happened here as if the lack of it supports your premise. It doesn't.
You're just citing a few predictions that don't square with a team playing its worst basketball at the end of the year. So what?The team was still getting a 2 seed per final bracket drop. 21% of Final Four teams come from the 2 line in the history of the tournament since they started seeding in 1979.
Obviously, the 2nd most popular seed to reach the Final Four.
NCAA Final Four Appearances by Seed
www.printyourbrackets.com
And if you were so damn good to close out last year, WTH happened to your expectations this year?...
Last edited:
You can't have it both ways--although I'm sure you'll try... The same preseason odds that placed LPT at 12-1 have Nova, the Zags, and Baylor at the top. Six weeks in, that's where those teams are.
LINK
Simply put, Vegas often gets it wrong. Their predictions aren't conclusive evidence of anything. Intellectually dishonest is trying to tell me otherwise. Why don't we just hang a banner for the championship we didn't get to finish last season with?...
Last edited:
And for anyone trying to use a short roster as an excuse, whose fault is that? Mother Nature's? Trump's? Beshear's?
I don't recall reading that Louisville leads the nation in Covid cases. And I haven't kept track, but it seems like all of these rescheduled games are due to outbreaks at the home school. How are our opponents staying healthy and ready to play?
Don't I recall a decade or so ago where Pitino was being criticized for his practice and conditioning regimen and how it contributes to injuries? Anyone think Mack deserves some scrutiny for that?
And why don't we have a backup center on the roster who can step in while Williams is out? If Igiehon isn't ready, why is he here? Who makes the recruiting decisions?
A guy making $4 million a year has accountabilities that go far beyond in-game coaching. That's if you wanna hold him accountable for anything...
I don't recall reading that Louisville leads the nation in Covid cases. And I haven't kept track, but it seems like all of these rescheduled games are due to outbreaks at the home school. How are our opponents staying healthy and ready to play?
Don't I recall a decade or so ago where Pitino was being criticized for his practice and conditioning regimen and how it contributes to injuries? Anyone think Mack deserves some scrutiny for that?
And why don't we have a backup center on the roster who can step in while Williams is out? If Igiehon isn't ready, why is he here? Who makes the recruiting decisions?
A guy making $4 million a year has accountabilities that go far beyond in-game coaching. That's if you wanna hold him accountable for anything...
Last edited:
So the process from the title of the thread is not a plan just a natural event? Either way, the process hit a snag tonight. Looked like a solid conference win on the road at Pitt to me. Yea! Now to get ready for the next game.
“Simply put, Vegas often gets it wrong. Their predictions aren't conclusive evidence of anything.”
We can’t make a conclusive statement about something that unfortunately didn’t have a result. However to argue that UofL wasn’t a strong final four contender when Vegas had them pegged at #7 is absurd. At that point the betting markets were the best gauge of the relative merits of each team 30+ games into the season.
We can’t make a conclusive statement about something that unfortunately didn’t have a result. However to argue that UofL wasn’t a strong final four contender when Vegas had them pegged at #7 is absurd. At that point the betting markets were the best gauge of the relative merits of each team 30+ games into the season.
I didn't cite predictions, I cited RESULTS since 1979.
Roster turnover. You return 1 guy that played over 10 min per from the prior team. The replacements are FR/SO, 5th YR SR, and some hurt guys... It is really weird you're asking WTH happened to expectations.
Your responses make you look highly uninformed about the NCAA Tourney history and the UofL program. If you can't comprehend massive roster overhaul from one year to the next, I have no idea why you are posting on a college basketball forum. Why didn't the team after Pitino's first Final Four make the NCAAs the next year??? Roster turnover my lord!
To me, it looks like the NCAA has decided to make an example of us. Part of that is punishing us and demonstrating their sanctions work. UofL having a 24-win season last year that could have turned into a championship is not an example of NCAA rules enforcement working at its best. They can't show 24 wins to entities that are currently getting in their business like Congress and the Supreme Court.
Luckily for the NCAA, they have another major violation at UofL to tack on top. And this time, they're going to make sure our program is set back significantly with a 1-2 year Tournament ban. I hope I'm wrong but that's what I see coming.
I'm sure recruits see that coming. If they don't, the coaches recruiting against us are busy pointing it all out.
I'm amazed we're still winning at all with the NCAA trying to use us as the poster boy for how punishment works. They're going to get their way at least over the short term with the Tournament bans. Once we get past that maybe we can rebuild. I hope so.
I don't blame Pitino, Jurich, Tyra, Mack, or any players for our problems. This is just the world we live in. It is often not fair. All kinds of cheating is going on all over the country. Read Jerry Tarkanian's book. We are just unlucky that we are going to have to bear the brunt of the NCAA's punishments so that schools more important to the NCAA can continue to skate free and stay under the radar.
Luckily for the NCAA, they have another major violation at UofL to tack on top. And this time, they're going to make sure our program is set back significantly with a 1-2 year Tournament ban. I hope I'm wrong but that's what I see coming.
I'm sure recruits see that coming. If they don't, the coaches recruiting against us are busy pointing it all out.
I'm amazed we're still winning at all with the NCAA trying to use us as the poster boy for how punishment works. They're going to get their way at least over the short term with the Tournament bans. Once we get past that maybe we can rebuild. I hope so.
I don't blame Pitino, Jurich, Tyra, Mack, or any players for our problems. This is just the world we live in. It is often not fair. All kinds of cheating is going on all over the country. Read Jerry Tarkanian's book. We are just unlucky that we are going to have to bear the brunt of the NCAA's punishments so that schools more important to the NCAA can continue to skate free and stay under the radar.
Facts are usually good enough for me. And we have FACTS showing U of L was playing its worst basketball of the season when last year ended. (Just like the year before I might add...)
If we were 30-0 when that run of games started, maybe its "worst" would have been good enough. But we were not 30-0...
So your stat showing 21% of teams advancing to the Final Four from a 2-seed is indicative of a "strong contender,' to use Knuckles' term? That's a reach when there's a 79% chance you don't. Hell, you have a chance of getting there just being in the tourney.
Call me the next time you wanna place a Vegas bet. I might book it for you.
As much as I like stats, I'll use applicable facts when they're available in lieu of predictive statistics. The last two years, Mack's teams have been playing their worst basketball when the season ended. And until the facts change, he still hasn't won an NCAA tourney game here...
Didn’t the 2012 final four team lose by 31 to an awful 15-17 Providence team that year? Also UofL lost 4 of their last 6 regular season games that year, not to mention 5 of 7 during the middle. 40 point loss is what is, but that doesn’t mean the ship is sinking. Losing by 40 to an experienced team and also being short handed is not the end of the world. It’s sports shit happens. Hell Michigan St was down by as many as 23 the other night to Northwestern. Maybe Mack wasn’t the best hire maybe he was. Time will tell.. but I can assure you Pitino wasn’t the right hire in the end either.
Can we get back on topic and the title of this thread and show or disprove how the “process” is going! : )
Getting back to the OP, this supposedly "doomed to mid-tier P5 status" program is now 5-1 and 1-0 in the ACC, after beating a 5-1 conference team on road.
Should be all the stats we need at this point. Thankfully, the 40-point loss only counts as one....
Should be all the stats we need at this point. Thankfully, the 40-point loss only counts as one....
You are too close to dispassionately look at the numbers. If Vegas thought we were falling off the cliff then the money would’ve fallen as well. Vegas odds were the most objective measure at the time the season ended.
21% is a high % and it's over 40 + years. You don't like that data. 2 seed pulls more Final Four Teams than the 3 & 4 seeds combined. It's a significant statistic.
Seeds 12-16 haver never made it. So hell, that's not much of a chance based on results.
Last post for me before the lock. Zipp is getting his azz kicked. He'll call in his paid member status after some final BS thoughts and have the thread locked. And Tom still won't be our.... or any other universities AD.
And before the 2012 NCAA tourney, how contented and philosophical were the fans? That's my point...
- Status
