Simply cannot compare the players of Bobby knight's generation with today's "me first" mentality. Bobby could intimidate a player into running through a brick wall if he wanted. At least kids "feared" or "respected" their elders.
Listening to slapd!ck talk radio at the moment...
- Thread starter zipp
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Maybe you're right... But you're not going to get a lotta 60-somethings "accommodate their styles" or POVs. Trust me, I have personal experience!
And maybe for that reason Pitino doesn't win another title...
Those guys still exist further down the talent food chain. The question is whether the talent to win is high enough too far down that chain. Perhaps not...
Rick is recruiting as good of talent now as he ever has and this is coming from a fan who doesn't love Rick and everything he does, but if kids like Nanu and Donovan keep leaving early he won't win another title. You need talent. Kids like King, Adel, Mitchell, Willaims, Courtney Ramey and Anfernee Simmons are great multi-year players that you need to stick around 2-3 years while you surround them with truly elite NBA level talent and Rick knows that. He went after Fox, Fultz, Josh Jackson, Jonathan Isaac, Miles Bridges, Bam, etc...all of those kids are 1st round/mostly lottery pick level talent and he came away with exactly none of them.
Listen, I know you're never in a million years going to give an ounce of credit to Calipari and yes you'll run into things like the 38-1 or the Wall/Cousins year where for one reason or another you don't win a title..winning an NCAA title is the hardest championship to win in sports. But Cal has been the most successful coach in the country year in and year out since coming to UK...He has more Final Fours in 8 years than Rick has in 16...Why? Because 98% of the time he takes the court he is putting the most talented team on the court. So talent wins. Now, Cal isn't the greatest coach...but Rick is. If he would put his ego aside and pander to these elite kids the way Cal does, the way Sean Miller and Coach K do....if his system was more freshman friendly....he would win a lot more games.
Pitino and Pitino Lite do things their own way, and each guy has had his share of success. No one guy more than the other from a big picture perspective...
They each have one NCAA championship over the last eight years. Lite has the higher win percentage, 0.825 vs. 0.755. But he also plays two-thirds of his schedule in the SEC, while Rick has played Big East and ACC schedules. And that easily explains the fact that Lite has averaged four more wins per season. Perfectly accounted for.
Lite does it mostly with talent, and Pitino does it more with coaching. No one questions that. All that proves is there's more than one way to skin a cat, not that you should try to get more of Lite's talent. Pitino is who he is, and I'd argue he's repeating past mistakes trying to sign better players. He's proven he can't accomplish what he wants with those guys.
That's not to say you need NO talent. Fortunately, there's a lotta players covering the full talent spectrum. And most kids who know they have little chance at an NBA career are gonna bust their a$$es proving otherwise. THOSE are the guys Pitino's program is built on...
You are contradicting yourself. This is what happens at times when people construct lengthy posts.
You are saying UofL needed one guy to get buckets on his own, then you are also saying they needed Gorgui, Chane, Look, Peyton, and Russ to develop...that's not so "simple" either, as you put it. Nor is it just "one guy" getting buckets on his own.
Also, you listed 5 guys - that's a team. Not one guy.
Furthermore - clearly UofL needed Henderson to get by Wich St. Blackshear, Harrell, and Ware were also steady contributors to the team.
So really UofL needed lots of guys, not just one guy to get buckets on his own.
Also, UofL always has at least one guy that can do what you say - get their own shot. From Russ, to Terry, to Mitchell, and prior to those guys Reece, Cisco, Williams, Clark, Sosa, etc, etc, etc.
For UofL to go the distance they need a strong experienced team that can excel on both ends of the court.
The D has remained top shelf, but the O has dropped off.
And the stick that stirs the drink is Rick Pitino. Yes our offense is not what most of us want but it is defense that wins titles. How many of you think a coach like Calivacate could have won a title with the players that Rick had at UofL back in '13? I sure as hell don't as he can't win with NBA all-star talent most years. A lot of our fans, including me from time to time, are critical of Rick Pitino but at the end of the day he is one of the best coaches in the history of college basketball. I, for one, am hoping that he survives this latest stuff with the NCAA and we move on to the sunset of his career.
GO CARDS - BEAT EVERYBODY!!! God Bless America!!!
I'd say if both Rick and cal submitted to a little bit of a philosophy change then they may both benefit. If rick could develop a more fruitful place for blue chip freshmen and cal could take a few kids to groom for upperclassmenship then they would both reap the rewards. It's almost like the perfect coach is a perfect blend between these two Italian dudes. But ego is a powerful thing and right now neither guy is failing so I imagine they will stick to their paths
Obviously I wasn't saying all you need is one guy to get buckets to win a title. I was saying you need that one stud, that when you absolutely need a basket, he will get it for you. Rozier was the last one we had...Mitchell is like that in spurts and he could develop into that if he were to come back, but thats not likely to happen. Most of the time in order to get that player, Rick develops them because the kids that are ready to do that as Freshman aren't coming to play for Rick....and now the kids that Rick is trying to develop into that go-to player is leaving before UL gets to see them on that level.
Also, I agree with @Rockfly78 ...if Rick would take about 30% of Cal's showmanship, marketing, and personality and apply it to his system and recruiting, he would be unstoppable....and if Cal would actually try and stop worrying about lottery picks and worry about developing an NCAA championship level team, then he would be unstoppable. But both are far, far too arrogant to do that.
Not buying that for a second. Here is what I see when I look at the two coaches, and please keep in mind this has been my thought regarding both since they came into my life.
Rick Pitino - Huge ego - Great at teaching the game to players AND assistant coaches. Always works hard for results. Became less of a prick after 9/11/2001 because it changed his life on a personal level. He still has a huge ego, but he is more likable now than he used to be. He still over exaggerates when he speaks and it is nauseating. He appears to care about the student-athlete concept which I do like.
John Calipari - Huge ego - He always struck me as a coach who will take shortcuts to succeed. He sells the product (player) better than any other coach in D1. He is very conceded. He has no coaching tree to speak of, and is generally considered a players only coach. As most coaches do, he has improved his in game coaching skills over the course of time. When his shortcuts catch up to him, he cuts and runs. IF he is still taking shortcuts (and I'm not saying he is), then when it comes out, he'll throw UofK's athletic department under the bus and leave for the NBA.
Uh, you say this as if Rozier's been gone a decade. There's only been two teams since he's left. And D. Lee got buckets the year after, and so did Mitchell this past season.
You're shooting for an angle that isn't there.
The problems involve below par shooting from 3 and the FT line. PG play has also been pedestrian.
You do have a good point about Pitino trying to develop experienced top players when they are bolting after 2 years. Rozier, Onuaku, now Mitchell, and maybe Adel too. It's officially a trend. This is a good point you're making - you should expand on that you're for sure on to something there.
UofL will be just fine. I was incorrect with my prediction. I have nothing but good wishes for Donovan Mitchell and gratitude for his two seasons here.
GO CARDS - BEAT EVERYBODY!!! God Bless America!!!
Exactly. Not one single post bashing the young man from any of the fans who bleed red for his decision. That makes me proud to be a Cards fan.
I was glad to see that. I'll have to update the total-five-stars-with-one-title count once the Bamba kid decides.
I'll also embellish the definition of insanity: repeating the same thing expecting better results.
"Elite program," my a$$...
Right. It's an AAU all star team on loan for 6 months. We get it. Good luck with that.
