Schnellenberger ready for it to happen this season

[TopCard]

Schnelly is on board with Lamar Jackson, also wants 16 teams in playoffs

http://uoflcardgame.com/schnellenberger-sorry-left-louisville-doubles-prophesy/52399/

 

[zipp]

Good read, Charlie. Can't ever read too much on/from The Pipe...

 

[flyercard]

Schnelly is on board with Lamar Jackson, also wants 16 teams in playoffs

http://uoflcardgame.com/schnellenberger-sorry-left-louisville-doubles-prophesy/52399/

Schnelly got screwed by the UL president at the time. Recently, Schnelly said he was surprised the UL fans weren't mad at him for leaving. Those of us who experienced what he had done for the program and how he was treated by the Administration, did not blame him for leaving.

 

[zipp]

That's correct. Donald Swain and Bill Olsen should never have taken any football-related action without Howard's approval. It wasn't like a ticket on the CUSA train was standing-room-only in 1995. Swain was a boob, and Olsen was a basketball guy. Howie was screwed...

 

[CommodoreCard]

Do y'all think that Louisville football would have survived as an Independent instead of joining Conference USA? This would be in all sports not just football. I don't think that we'd like to see the outcome of that scenario. Jurich would have never came here. JMHO.

 

[tkdcoach]

Do y'all think that Louisville football would have survived as an Independent instead of joining Conference USA? This would be in all sports not just football. I don't think that we'd like to see the outcome of that scenario. Jurich would have never came here. JMHO.

No, we wouldn't have survived. We did the right thing IMO and as evidence I submit our ACC membership. I would've loved to have seen us in Big East in that era just the same but that was not happening.

 

[zipp]

We would have been in a conference eventually. But Schnelly should have been a big player in that analysis and decision, not dragged along by administrators who had no football in their backgrounds. I think Jurich would have handled that situation a helluva lot better, and he sure didn't come here because we were a charter member of CUSA...

 

[gocds]

Actually, even though I'm "old", I thought Shumaker (sp) was the president when we joined CUSA. But I think that Howard understands that he made a significant error by leaving here for OU. I think that much is obvious. And I agree that we could not have survived as an independent. We really didn't have much choice but to hook up with CUSA at that time. I wish Howard had stayed here but history is history and it is what it is.

GO CARDS - BEAT EVERYBODY!!! God Bless America!!!

 

[Kratz]

Pipe was working on a deal to get us into the BE at the time. Look back at the schedules and you'll see a lot of BE teams being played. He was derailed on that by Swain and Olsen, they chose the CUSA path. CUSA was chosen because they let UofL keep the bulk of their own basketball money.

Howard knew that CUSA was a football dead end, so he chose to leave because the administration wasn't committed to football at that time.

 

[tkdcoach]

We would have been in a conference eventually. But Schnelly should have been a big player in that analysis and decision, not dragged along by administrators who had no football in their backgrounds. I think Jurich would have handled that situation a helluva lot better, and he sure didn't come here because we were a charter member of CUSA...

Don't agree with ya on this one at all. If it hadn't been for Olsen there wouldn't have been a CHS. How you get from that bold move to blaming him and Swain, well, search me.

 

[tkdcoach]

Pipe was working on a deal to get us into the BE at the time. Look back at the schedules and you'll see a lot of BE teams being played. He was derailed on that by Swain and Olsen, they chose the CUSA path. CUSA was chosen because they let UofL keep the bulk of their own basketball money.

Howard knew that CUSA was a football dead end, so he chose to leave because the administration wasn't committed to football at that time.

He wasn't derailed; they didn't want us at that time. And yes, he did leave over it, but not because he had some brilliant plan to get us into the BE. The CFA and eventually the BCS were putting the cold freeze on independents (and more to the point,independents like us they put on the outside).

Y'all are forgetting (or leaving out) how the landscape changed entirely. If we had remained an independent, those games would disappear (and in fact they did...only a few years later we couldn't get good teams to play us at all H&A). I call revisionist history. And it's all a very moot revisionist history to boot.

Saying we weren't "committed to football at that time" WHILE we were raising funds for the building of PJCS only underlines how that's not the case. CHS' entire presence was a commitment to football.

 

[Guardman]

Many stories could be written, but no one knows how they would have all come out. We are fine now, but Independence and co-incident Excellence would have provided more long term options, but at much much greater risk.

I am satisfied now, but I would like to see how the alternate reality may have come out.

 

[zipp]

I still recall the B&W newspaper picture of Olsen and Swain the day Howard resigned looking confused and like "WTH happened?" "You guys fumbled the punt" is what happened.

Again, CUSA was not some slat-full, juggernaut football train leaving the station and never to return. Fine if these guys jumped a little too quickly moving to a good football conference 20+ years ago. But a new conference with Tulane, South Florida, St. Louis, Memphis, Marquette, Houston, DePaul, Cincy, UAB, and Southern Miss didn't justify an urgent decision without the support of the best football coach in our history to that point.

We just had two boobs at the controls (Yes I'm lumping Olsen in there now...)

 

[tkdcoach]

Once again, the CFA chain of events, and not C-USA, was the non-boob-ish event that caused the rest. Good thing Olsen and Swain (to a lesser extent) acted or we wouldn't have been where we are today. But y'all keep on being right and certain to allocate fault on an AD who made the decision to build U of L football with basketball money in the first instance. He's certainly a bad person for that audacity and deserves nothing but the blame. Whatever ;-)

I still recall the B&W newspaper picture of Olsen and Swain the day Howard resigned looking confused and like "WTH happened?" "You guys fumbled the punt" is what happened.

Again, CUSA was not some slat-full, juggernaut football train leaving the station and never to return. Fine if these guys jumped a little too quickly moving to a good football conference 20+ years ago. But a new conference with Tulane, South Florida, St. Louis, Memphis, Marquette, Houston, DePaul, Cincy, UAB, and Southern Miss didn't justify an urgent decision without the support of the best football coach in our history to that point.

We just had two boobs at the controls (Yes I'm lumping Olsen in there now...)

 

[gocds]

Once again, the CFA chain of events, and not C-USA, was the non-boob-ish event that caused the rest. Good thing Olsen and Swain (to a lesser extent) acted or we wouldn't have been where we are today. But y'all keep on being right and certain to allocate fault on an AD who made the decision to build U of L football with basketball money in the first instance. He's certainly a bad person for that audacity and deserves nothing but the blame. Whatever ;-)

tkd even though I'm still not convinced that Olsen was a great AD (allowing the latter Crum years) I am convinced that your statement above is essentially correct. His move to sell football tickets by setting the rule that basketball tickets had to be purchased only if football tickets were purchased was marketing genius. Howard was an incredible football mind but his ego got the best of him and he left for OU. That was his mistake not UofL's.

GO CARDS - BEAT EVERYBODY!!! God Bless America!!!

 

[zipp]

I hesitate to lump Olsen in with Swain. Bill was a fine AD on the basketball side of things. But he was far from a great AD overall. He was shortsighted on the importance of a total sports program, and he obviously fostered some loose relationships in basketball that got us into some trouble eventually. I'm not sure he could exactly be viewed as a strong proponent of the "student" part of student-athletes. He certainly didn't cultivate great relationships in the conferences we played in.

Unfortunately, all ADs past and present pale in comparison to Jurich. Is Brainfart really a terrible AD? Was Olsen? If the standard is Jurich, maybe. We're spoiled by his excellence, and the performance standard is so much higher as a result. Not necessarily a bad thing...and why coaches stay here and realize they made a big mistake when they leave...

 

[GoldCard]

It's not just that they went behind his back to join C-USA, it's how poorly conceived that conference was from the beginning. Including non-football members was a huge mistake, especially Saint Louis and UNC Charlotte. At the time, NCAA rules only required 6 teams in a conference, which means they could've remained small, freeing up 6 OOC games on the schedule and an interesting triple round robin in basketball.

 

[CommodoreCard]

If Louisville didn't join C-USA what league would they have joined? The Horizon League? The Ohio Valley? The Big East wanted no part of UofL at the time, our Title 9 compliance was a shambles, facilities were Middle School at best. Olsen was a lot like RC Johnson at Memphis...just cared about basketball and nothing else. Memphis is still paying the price to this day for Johnson's ineptness.

I love Howard but like another poster said, Howard let his ego get in the way. He could have joined the league and dominated it and still scheduled larger programs. It's not like Crum's teams were dominating the scene in C-USA. St. Louis and UNCC handed his teams many loses in the decade of the 90's.

I am grateful for the way things turned out.

 

[GoldCard]

If Louisville didn't join C-USA what league would they have joined? The Horizon League? The Ohio Valley? The Big East wanted no part of UofL at the time, our Title 9 compliance was a shambles, facilities were Middle School at best. Olsen was a lot like RC Johnson at Memphis...just cared about basketball and nothing else. Memphis is still paying the price to this day for Johnson's ineptness.

I love Howard but like another poster said, Howard let his ego get in the way. He could have joined the league and dominated it and still scheduled larger programs. It's not like Crum's teams were dominating the scene in C-USA. St. Louis and UNCC handed his teams many loses in the decade of the 90's.

I am grateful for the way things turned out.

Everyone is grateful for the way things turned out now. That doesn't change the fact that running off a championship coach was a gigantic mistake. Like I said, including non football schools in C-USA was foolish. Only Marquette brought anything of value to the table.

 

[flyercard]

Don't agree with ya on this one at all. If it hadn't been for Olsen there wouldn't have been a CHS. How you get from that bold move to blaming him and Swain, well, search me.

I don't blame Olsen. He was a good transition AD to a professional AD like Jurich. I also agree that the days of an independent not named Notre Dame was ending. I'm just not sure we had to jump into CUSA w/o Howard. I recall that shortly after the CUSA started UL wanted to oppose the admission of a football only team (Army) and we found out that there was a secret agreement fostered by Marquette to oust us if we exercised the veto we thought we had.

 

[CommodoreCard]

I remember C-USA members almost exercised that ouster of Louisville when we opposed the addition of East Carolina as a football only member.

 

[tkdcoach]

I don't blame Olsen. He was a good transition AD to a professional AD like Jurich. I also agree that the days of an independent not named Notre Dame was ending. I'm just not sure we had to jump into CUSA w/o Howard. I recall that shortly after the CUSA started UL wanted to oppose the admission of a football only team (Army) and we found out that there was a secret agreement fostered by Marquette to oust us if we exercised the veto we thought we had.

Agree 100% with the bolded above. Jurich is next level. I just don't agree with skewering Olsen who was at worst, a good guardian who wasn't perfect, but who overall deserves praise for having the vision to hire CHS. As such, he is the real founder of modern Louisville football. Nah, it's Coach S. but Olsen made it happen. Is that so wrong? No subsequent fallout can rob him of the credit he deserves for that accomplishment IMO.

Take a look at the big time opponents from the CHS era (Texas is a good example) and ask yourself how many of those programs would play a game at our significantly upgraded venue after the formation of the CFA especially once it gelled into the BCS?

Even the bad CHS deals such as with Ohio State (2 away games using Big Ten refs and we got jobbed big time) would dry up by the mid-90s no matter who was our coach. Who's to say what our schedule would look like by the late 90s without C-USA but the evidence for being on the wrong end of a deep freeze is pretty notable, I think. IIRC the Penn State visit was the last game of any major status we hosted from there to FSU in 2002. Which, in retrospect, was a great land. Once we won that (even though JLS phoned in most of that season while he shopped himself around) things got worse. I'd be willing to bet (but not sure what source there'd be to check) that the home-away with Miami was signed before we beat FSU? If not, kudos to The U. Especially once they did play the return game (we saw some big names opt out of contracts to play us and complaints about that fact were stock-and-trade on this board a decade ago). One last detail, TJ began to demand home-away deals (rightly, IMO), but by the time those games were played we were in the Big East. We were criticized for playing no one even though technically we were on the inside track (and got our first BCS slot as a result of that technicality).

I'm unsure what the last sentence about C-USA intrigue adds to the question of Olsen's legacy but I think both he and our basketball coach might've been coasting by then. Cooper was a bad hire for the right reasons and that one is definitely on Olsen (but oddly, none of his critics brought that up because it's painful. So if I were going to knock him it'd be on that hire, not on the CHS exit and the C-USA entry.

But then, our hero TJ made a parallel bad hire. Both those hires set us back and only the fan base's general loyalty (and its demand for a winning team) put us back on that collision course. Even in 2009, I wouldn't have "Olsened" Jurich over that. Sometimes even when we do our jobs things don't work out the way we hoped, right?

I'm not trying to make a federal case of it, people are free to blame Olsen for whatever they want, I just wanted to suggest a possible different explanation or at the least recap the mitigating factors of those years. Given the magnanimous, laudable context of Schnellenberger's linked remarks, I'm more than happy where we are now. It's probably a good time to bury the hatchet.

 

[zipp]

...I just don't agree with skewering Olsen who was at worst, a good guardian who wasn't perfect, but who overall deserves praise for having the vision to hire CHS...

Took a lot more than Olsen to get Schnelly here. And his hiring didn't make Olsen a great AD anymore than hiring Jurich made Shumaker a great Prez. Being at the right place at the right time accounts for a lot sometimes...

 

[CommodoreCard]

Oklahoma played in PJCS. Was it before or after Florida State? Still, very few "P5" teams came to PJCS once the CFA/BCS era started. I think the Florida State and Miami games were scheduled due to SEC teams dropping them last minute. Auburn dropped Florida State and I'm pretty sure Mississippi State dropped Miami. Jurich stepped right in and got us signed up to play home and home.

 

[tkdcoach]

All honest, successful people ack they're also lucky. I have no problem with that at all.

Took a lot more than Olsen to get Schnelly here. And his hiring didn't make Olsen a great AD anymore than hiring Jurich made Shumaker a great Prez. Being at the right place at the right time accounts for a lot sometimes...

 

[flyercard]

Agree 100% with the bolded above. Jurich is next level. I just don't agree with skewering Olsen who was at worst, a good guardian who wasn't perfect, but who overall deserves praise for having the vision to hire CHS. As such, he is the real founder of modern Louisville football. Nah, it's Coach S. but Olsen made it happen. Is that so wrong? No subsequent fallout can rob him of the credit he deserves for that accomplishment IMO.

Take a look at the big time opponents from the CHS era (Texas is a good example) and ask yourself how many of those programs would play a game at our significantly upgraded venue after the formation of the CFA especially once it gelled into the BCS?

Even the bad CHS deals such as with Ohio State (2 away games using Big Ten refs and we got jobbed big time) would dry up by the mid-90s no matter who was our coach. Who's to say what our schedule would look like by the late 90s without C-USA but the evidence for being on the wrong end of a deep freeze is pretty notable, I think. IIRC the Penn State visit was the last game of any major status we hosted from there to FSU in 2002. Which, in retrospect, was a great land. Once we won that (even though JLS phoned in most of that season while he shopped himself around) things got worse. I'd be willing to bet (but not sure what source there'd be to check) that the home-away with Miami was signed before we beat FSU? If not, kudos to The U. Especially once they did play the return game (we saw some big names opt out of contracts to play us and complaints about that fact were stock-and-trade on this board a decade ago). One last detail, TJ began to demand home-away deals (rightly, IMO), but by the time those games were played we were in the Big East. We were criticized for playing no one even though technically we were on the inside track (and got our first BCS slot as a result of that technicality).

I'm unsure what the last sentence about C-USA intrigue adds to the question of Olsen's legacy but I think both he and our basketball coach might've been coasting by then. Cooper was a bad hire for the right reasons and that one is definitely on Olsen (but oddly, none of his critics brought that up because it's painful. So if I were going to knock him it'd be on that hire, not on the CHS exit and the C-USA entry.

But then, our hero TJ made a parallel bad hire. Both those hires set us back and only the fan base's general loyalty (and its demand for a winning team) put us back on that collision course. Even in 2009, I wouldn't have "Olsened" Jurich over that. Sometimes even when we do our jobs things don't work out the way we hoped, right?

I'm not trying to make a federal case of it, people are free to blame Olsen for whatever they want, I just wanted to suggest a possible different explanation or at the least recap the mitigating factors of those years. Given the magnanimous, laudable context of Schnellenberger's linked remarks, I'm more than happy where we are now. It's probably a good time to bury the hatchet.

It was not my intention to intimate that Olsen (or for that matter Swain) knew about the Marquette cabal. I relate it to point out that the CUSA deal had some major flaws of which we were not aware until the later lawsuit. Again whether we could have held on as an independent until some of early defections from the Big East is speculative, since BC tried to keep us out of the Big East until it defected to the ACC.

 

[zipp]

Worrying about getting into CUSA was much worse than our fans worrying about not getting a Big XII invite. And how did that latter situation work out?

"Some of God's greatest gifts are unanswered prayers." Don't force it...