John "It's about the Kids" Calipari

[BPGhost]

And by kids, he means only high school kids. He sure doesn't care about college students because if he did, he wouldn't have left a rambling voicemail message for a Philly reporter complaining how Damion Lee's transfer from Drexel got his buddy Loser Flint fired.

"The NCAA has a rule that a kid can leave a program like Drexel after being coached and molded for three years and go to another school without having to sit out,” Calipari said. “If Lee is there, they’re in the NCAA tournament. … It’s not about the school that took him. It’s about we let it happen."

Haven't heard one word from him about freshmen who don't go to class after Christmas but, he wants to impede the mobility of college students who have already graduated.

He is easily the biggest hypocrite in college athletics today.

 

[Steelers2012]

Point #1: Bruiser Flint was fired because he NEVER ONCE made the NCAA tournament in his 15 seasons at Drexel. I'm not sure what took them so long to pull the plug.

Point #2: Flint and Drexel went 11-19 last season WITH Damion Lee and his 21.4 pts/gm.

Point #3: In the 2012-13 season, John Calipari took Wright State's leading scorer, senior Julius Mays, away to play his final season at UK.

 

[Bigblueforever]

Point #1: Bruiser Flint was fired because he NEVER ONCE made the NCAA tournament in his 15 seasons at Drexel. I'm not sure what took them so long to pull the plug.

Point #2: Flint and Drexel went 11-19 last season WITH Damion Lee and his 21.4 pts/gm.

Point #3: In the 2012-13 season, John Calipari took Wright State's leading scorer, senior Julius Mays, away to play his final season at UK.

His coach had already left that program, they were looking for a new coach when Mays left.

 

[CardinalJunky]

John Calipari brings to mind the word "fckery". He's just a jackal 24/7. He can't help himself.

 

[Deeva]

His coach had already left that program, they were looking for a new coach when Mays left.

It still happened...

 

[MtCardinal]

His coach had already left that program, they were looking for a new coach when Mays left.

Kids sign with schools not coaches, so the coach leaving should have played no part of his leaving. Or are you saying that all these McD AA you have gotten these last few years are signing with the coach? That's not what uk fans have been saying for the last 8 years.

 

[CardsFirst]

His coach had already left that program, they were looking for a new coach when Mays left.

Typical sUcK fan making an excuse what's new with that. Do us a favor and go back to your board. Doesn't take much bait to catch a scat.

 

[ALLNCARD]

I love how Lee and Lewis have been called out on this all season. Several players have left to better their chances & to better their basketball careers with an education (which is why you go to school). If the NCAA changes this rule, they should penalize the schools more that have low graduation rates for scholarship players. I like how a school that can manipulate the system wants to comment on a players leaving another school. It's about about the kids (and education) not the coaches.

 

[bloodguard13]

And by kids, he means only high school kids. He sure doesn't care about college students because if he did, he wouldn't have left a rambling voicemail message for a Philly reporter complaining how Damion Lee's transfer from Drexel got his buddy Loser Flint fired.

"The NCAA has a rule that a kid can leave a program like Drexel after being coached and molded for three years and go to another school without having to sit out,” Calipari said. “If Lee is there, they’re in the NCAA tournament. … It’s not about the school that took him. It’s about we let it happen."

Haven't heard one word from him about freshmen who don't go to class after Christmas but, he wants to impede the mobility of college students who have already graduated.

He is easily the biggest hypocrite in college athletics today.

Speaking of hypocrite, would i be a hypocrite if i dogged the one and done system and then when my team used 2 one and done players, i made excuses and claimed they were different than your one and done players?

 

[bloodguard13]

I had a guy at work tell me that he didn't like the one and done players because you dont get to know the players and build any kind of emotional attachment to them. And now he has been saying that these are good kids and that he feels bad for them and that they are getting screwed (which i agree with). I didn't point the obvious but you get what i am saying.

 

[Steelers2012]

His coach had already left that program, they were looking for a new coach when Mays left.

Billy Donlon has been, and still is, the coach at Wright State since the 2010-11 season. Julius Mays played for that same current Coach Donlon during the 2011-12 season. In other words, they were not looking for a new coach, nor did Mays leave during or after a coaching change. However, John Calipari did take Wright State's leading scorer away from his teammates aka "the kids". Interestingly enough, Wright State went from a 13-19 record during May's final season there, to 21-12 without him.

 

[rockycard]

His coach had already left that program, they were looking for a new coach when Mays left.

I think you missed the most important thing, Calipari has always said that the kids come first, why is he siding with a coach and not the kid?

 

[Cue Card]

Speaking of hypocrite, would i be a hypocrite if i dogged the one and done system and then when my team used 2 one and done players, i made excuses and claimed they were different than your one and done players?

I realize this is probably beyond your ability to comprehend, but the 2 one and done players you are speaking about for UofL were actually DONE and then ONE players which means they actually went to college and earned degrees before using their last year of college eligibility. So you're not being a hypocrite. You're just being close minded and ignorant.

 

[bloodguard13]

Billy Donlon has been, and still is, the coach at Wright State since the 2010-11 season. Julius Mays played for that same current Coach Donlon during the 2011-12 season. In other words, they were not looking for a new coach, nor did Mays leave during or after a coaching change. However, John Calipari did take Wright State's leading scorer away from his teammates aka "the kids". Interestingly enough, Wright State went from a 13-19 record during May's final season there, to 21-12 without him.

So you're saying he did them a favor?

I realize this is probably beyond your ability to comprehend, but the 2 one and done players you are speaking about for UofL were actually DONE and then ONE players which means they actually went to college and earned degrees before using their last year of college eligibility. So you're not being a hypocrite. You're just being close minded and ignorant.

I guess you are correct, i can't comprehend how players that sign to play 1 year for your team are different from players that sign to play 1 year for your team.

 

[Shawn (uk7spd)]

I am on the fence about this issue, but as far as Cal is concerned, I am not sure why this would be hypocritical. He has vocally opposed the one-and-one rule despite being known for one-and-done, and now has publicly opposed the grad transfer rule. He also was very clear to say that he takes advantage of both rules (and also said it is not about Louisville taking advantage of the rule either), which I have no problem with because you aren't doing your job if you don't try to field the best team within the rules. I find it refreshing that someone is willing to call out things that they think are bad for the game even where they have taken advantage of them.

 

[REDFISTFURY3]

He only says that hyperbole about the one and done rule because he has connections to the best of the best regardless. And beleive Cal if you want ! he wouldn't be able to win crap with the level of talent that most teams get gurantee he wouldnt be able to coach this U of l team and win big.

 

[L1c4tillidie]

He's full of it. I'm embarrassed that he even lives in the same state as tom jurich.

 

[kozmas]

Everybody ignore the sUcK fans and the stupid comments they make. They don't understand the difference between done and one and a college education and one and done and no college education. That is because most of sUcKs toothless fan base never went to college.
When I started reading the thread I had plans to go a totally different direct but the sUcK fans pulled in another direction. However during one or OUR games Jay Bilas made an interesting point about Lee and Lewis and the done and one player. He said the the athletes in college are not employees of the universities and they have the right to go where they want and the end of their scholarship.
Most college scholarships are awarded on a year to year bases and the players are evaluated and the scholarships are renewed yearly.

 

[Shawn (uk7spd)]

Everybody ignore the sUcK fans and the stupid comments they make. They don't understand the difference between done and one and a college education and one and done and no college education. That is because most of sUcKs toothless fan base never went to college.
When I started reading the thread I had plans to go a totally different direct but the sUcK fans pulled in another direction. However during one or OUR games Jay Bilas made an interesting point about Lee and Lewis and the done and one player. He said the the athletes in college are not employees of the universities and they have the right to go where they want and the end of their scholarship.
Most college scholarships are awarded on a year to year bases and the players are evaluated and the scholarships are renewed yearly.

They are obviously different in some respects (i.e., the "done-and-ones" have actually spent real time in school and graduated, which is admirable, even though they would have gone pro if they had the option), but they are not different in other respects. For example, many coaches and fans have argued that their programs should not recruit kids who are only going to be there for one year because that is not the way college basketball should work (i.e., they are mercenaries for that one year at the school) and there is no time to get an emotional attachment. Well, done-and-ones are actually worse in that respect because they are guaranteed to be at the school for only one year, whereas there is a good chance that one-and-done type kids may not leave after one year (happens quite frequently, even at Kentucky).

So, using Lee and Lewis as examples (good kids, so this is not about them), when Pitino recruited them, he did so knowing that they were only going to be at Louisville for one year no matter what. In that sense, they are mercenaries just as much as one-and-dones could be considered mercenaries. Louisville fans have obviously made an attachment to Lee and Lewis and they have in turn made an attachment with Louisville, so, if anything comes out of this, hopefully other fans will see that even kids who only attend a school for one year can mean a lot to the fans and vice versa (for example, many of UK's one-and-dones actively support the program).

 

[BPGhost]

Speaking of hypocrite, would i be a hypocrite if i dogged the one and done system and then when my team used 2 one and done players, i made excuses and claimed they were different than your one and done players?

Yes. Also, you would be incapable of discerning legitimate difference very the two scenarios. One - championed by the yut coach, is a system that embraces those players uninterested in the college experience and yet, forced into it by those market forces supporting the NCAA. The other supported by most people, is one that allows the STUDENT-ATHLETE who has GRADUATED (remember that's the goal) to play for a program they are interested in after graduating.

Perhaps now you understand the difference.

 

[BPGhost]

I think you missed the most important thing, Calipari has always said that the kids come first, why is he siding with a coach and not the kid?

Because he's BS...and not really for the kids EXCEPT when it benefits him.

 

[BPGhost]

So you're saying he did them a favor?

I guess you are correct, i can't comprehend how players that sign to play 1 year for your team are different from players that sign to play 1 year for your team.

Here's a tip - One player has graduated college and one, has graduated (purportedly) high school. I've no confidence that is simplistic for you enough to understand but, there it is.

 

[cardfaninmemphis]

His coach had already left that program, they were looking for a new coach when Mays left.

That point is irrelevant to Calipari's arguements. He has placed no conditions on his opposition to this transfer rule.

 

[cardfaninmemphis]

I guess you are correct, i can't comprehend how players that sign to play 1 year for your team are different from players that sign to play 1 year for your team.

Here is the difference:

A guy with a college degree transfers to another school in hopes of getting more exposure to NBA scouts and to improve his game with the help of a better coach and better competition. If he does not get drafted, or if he does get drafted but the NBA does not work out, he still has a college degree that he can put to use.

A guy who just finished high school goes to a school with the hopes of going straight to the NBA after one year. He does enough to stay eligible, but everybody knows that basketball, not school, is his priority. If he makes it in the NBA, great. If he washes out, he is on his own as another guy wasted an opportunity to get a college education. He made some money in the NBA, but will blow through it as he got used to the lifestyle but lost the means to support it.

 

[Shawn (uk7spd)]

Here is the difference:

A guy with a college degree transfers to another school in hopes of getting more exposure to NBA scouts and to improve his game with the help of a better coach and better competition. If he does not get drafted, or if he does get drafted but the NBA does not work out, he still has a college degree that he can put to use.

A guy who just finished high school goes to a school with the hopes of going straight to the NBA after one year. He does enough to stay eligible, but everybody knows that basketball, not school, is his priority. If he makes it in the NBA, great. If he washes out, he is on his own as another guy wasted an opportunity to get a college education. He made some money in the NBA, but will blow through it as he got used to the lifestyle but lost the means to support it.

You make a lot of assumptions. The one-and-done can always go back to school, and many do even if they are successful in the NBA. School will always be there...the NBA will not. In your scenarios, I would rather be the one-and-done who is a bust but has a lot of money to show for it and can always finish school with a ton of money left over. The bottom line is that done-and-ones aren't on some righteous pursuit of a college education. They are no different than one-and-dones...other than their ability to play basketball is simply not as good (or at least takes longer to realize).

 

[JohnKBA]

Cal is off the reservation on this one. I won't complain about the unprecedented success he has had at UK, but he is flat wrong on this one. And yes, hypocritical is the best way to describe his stance here.

 

[cuzimacardfan]

Is he mad at Gonzaga for taking Wiltjer away?

 

[thecycle21]

I actually think Cal has always been consistent on both of these issues. That being said he is like a preacher that condemns drinking but since it is legal drinks and blames it on the system. If he truly didn't believe in the one and done or 5th year transfer don't recruit those players. You sure wouldn't build you whole program around a principle you didn't believe in.

I have no trouble that he exploits the system, but just own it the one and done has made me the successful coach I am today.

The NCAA can fix this whole issue by making scholarships 4 year contracts. Then award kids a 5th year for graduating if they don't go pro. Then create a penalty system for universities that exploit the one and done players. Players that go pro, make the same academic process as a normal student and graduate in 4 years the universities receive no penalty. Players that just drops school all together the universities APR is impacted. The whole mission of the school is for all their students to graduate, it isn't to get them into a job as fast as possible.

 

[OneEarWonder]

I actually think Cal has always been consistent on both of these issues. That being said he is like a preacher that condemns drinking but since it is legal drinks and blames it on the system. If he truly didn't believe in the one and done or 5th year transfer don't recruit those players. You sure wouldn't build you whole program around a principle you didn't believe in.

I have no trouble that he exploits the system, but just own it the one and done has made me the successful coach I am today.

The NCAA can fix this whole issue by making scholarships 4 year contracts. Then award kids a 5th year for graduating if they don't go pro. Then create a penalty system for universities that exploit the one and done players. Players that go pro, make the same academic process as a normal student and graduate in 4 years the universities receive no penalty. Players that just drops school all together the universities APR is impacted. The whole mission of the school is for all their students to graduate, it isn't to get them into a job as fast as possible.

The NCAA would NEVER do that, it would weaken one of their big money makers. It makes no sense for them to penalize a school for a kid going pro. It also makes no sense to penalize a kid for graduating. Supposedly the concern over the grad transfer rule was that a low % of the transfers complete grad school... it is truly a 1 year deal. The argument to sit a year is to ensure they have 2 full years of grad school... but that could just as easily be fixed by requiring schools offer full scholarships (e.g. 2 years of grad school) but play immediately. IF a student walks away from the 2nd year of scholarship, that is on them.

If the NCAA cared about the students and not the money, the rules would be very different in lots of ways.

As far as one-and-done vs done-and-one. That's just semantics and splitting hairs. Yes, everyone knows the difference between a high school grad and a college grad, but the end result is the same - a one year player. And good for them! Many people here have criticized one and not the other then cry hypocrisy. Even CRP called these guys one-and-done... should be be lambasted as well?

 

[Bigblueforever]

Typical sUcK fan making an excuse what's new with that. Do us a favor and go back to your board. Doesn't take much bait to catch a scat.

What ever, Gone!

 

[nccardfan]

A lot of these issues could be resolved by 1) adopting what baseball does. Kids can go directly to the pros after high school. The problem is that there is no "farm" system in the NBA other than the d league. If a player chooses to go to college he must stay 3 years. At least this way there is some insurance that the kid is getting an education or working towards it. Kids who can't cut the 3 years can drop out and try to make it to the NBA on their own thus freeing up scholarships for other players. Coaches would just have to adjust on how they recruit. 2) I have no issue with making the graduate student sit out a season just like regular transfers.There should not be an immediate reward for a player who wants to extend his playing career (he's already earned his undergraduate degree). Are Lee and Lewis working on a masters or getting a secondary degree? Will they achieve it in one year? I think realistically there isn't much difference than the one and done and the done and one. Both are using one year as a chance to get to the NBA or to a professional career.

 

[kozmas]

Can anybody name any of the many players from UMass, Memphis or sUcK that left early and thencame back and received their degree ?

 

[Cue Card]

I guess you are correct, i can't comprehend how players that sign to play 1 year for your team are different from players that sign to play 1 year for your team.

Not surprised. I'll try to explain this as simply as I possibly can. I swear this will be my last stab at trying to help you understand the difference in the two situations.

The 5th year transfer STUDENT-athletes had already graduated from a college and still had 1 year of amateur status available to them to continue their college experience as STUDENT-athletes at a different college while they worked on their Masters degrees.

The one and done "it's all about the kids" players your pimp of a coach takes is to hype them up on a stage for a tryout for the next level. No worries, all those pesky academic requirements that come along with that approach have been dealt with since the first year when the 1.8 TEAM GPA debacle occurred. That slight oversight regarding his program running "tweaks" has been resolved. Again, it is all about the kids.

Now the hypocrite you call a coach is bashing the done and one approach while crying foul for his peers who had losing records even with talented players. Why did it stop being about the kids? Could it possibly be because it doesn't help HIS agenda? You know, the agenda that supports the theme "it's all about the kids" as long as it's the kids HE can get in to the NBA?

I'll let you decide.

 

[JohnKBA]

Can anybody name any of the many players from UMass, Memphis or sUcK that left early and thencame back and received their degree ?

Cal was hardly churning out awesome talent at either UMass or Memphis. I think before he got to UK, Rose was his only one and done player. UMass was Camby and a bunch of role players, and even Camby stayed 3 years. He's been at UK for almost 6 years. Not sure any of the guys who left early have come back and finished. I think the ones who have continued to work hard on their games are probably doing just fine financially anyway.

 

[cardfaninmemphis]

You make a lot of assumptions. The one-and-done can always go back to school, and many do even if they are successful in the NBA. School will always be there...the NBA will not. In your scenarios, I would rather be the one-and-done who is a bust but has a lot of money to show for it and can always finish school with a ton of money left over. The bottom line is that done-and-ones aren't on some righteous pursuit of a college education. They are no different than one-and-dones...other than their ability to play basketball is simply not as good (or at least takes longer to realize).

No, it is you who make the assumptions here. You assume they would go back to school on their own. If they do, they would do so without the supports, such as the structured schedule with built in study time, the academic assistance and tutoring, the athletic scholarship that now includes all of the other "cost of an education" benefits. When they come as a student-athlete, there are tons of people trying to keep them eligible so they can focus on sports. If they return, they are on their own, including their own motivation. If they haven't squandered the money they made in the NBA, as many do, tuition and the other expenses are not an issue.

You assume that they finish school "with a ton of money left over". It has been discussed in many places, including here, "a ton of money left over" is not the case. You assume that they save their NBA income and invest it wisely so that they can live a comfortable lifestyle afterwards. Instead, as people aged 19-25 would easily do, they live excessively thinking the gravy train will continue.

Of course, we know that Cal's one and Dones are not on "some righteous pursuit of education." UofL's guys aren't either; they already have it.

Got any more stupidity that you want to share about this topic?

 

[cardfaninmemphis]

What ever, Gone!

Best thing a UK fan has ever posted on this board!!!!!

 

[bloodguard13]

Here is the difference:

A guy with a college degree transfers to another school in hopes of getting more exposure to NBA scouts and to improve his game with the help of a better coach and better competition. If he does not get drafted, or if he does get drafted but the NBA does not work out, he still has a college degree that he can put to use.

A guy who just finished high school goes to a school with the hopes of going straight to the NBA after one year. He does enough to stay eligible, but everybody knows that basketball, not school, is his priority. If he makes it in the NBA, great. If he washes out, he is on his own as another guy wasted an opportunity to get a college education. He made some money in the NBA, but will blow through it as he got used to the lifestyle but lost the means to support it.

Ok, i think i got it, one player goes to a particular school for 1 year for a chance to win a Championship, to play for a Hall of Fame Coach, National media exposure, and a chance to Get drafted to play in the NBA. The other Player goes to a particular School for 1 year for a chance to win a Championship, to play for a Hall of Fame Coach, National media coverage, and a chance to get drafted to play in the NBA. I think you cleared it up pretty well.

 

[kozmas]

OK, so what you are saying is none of the players that have played for Cal at any school who left college early have come back to get his degree. But Shawn said that many of the players that leave school early for the NBA come back later and get their degree and they have a lot of money in their pockets. I guess Shawn wasn't talking about sUcK players even though this discussion was about Cal and the one and done system. I guess this discussion has evolved into a football discussion where sUcK fans use other schools achievements to back up their program.

 

[cardfaninmemphis]

Ok, i think i got it, one player goes to a particular school for 1 year for a chance to win a Championship, to play for a Hall of Fame Coach, National media exposure, and a chance to Get drafted to play in the NBA. The other Player goes to a particular School for 1 year for a chance to win a Championship, to play for a Hall of Fame Coach, National media coverage, and a chance to get drafted to play in the NBA. I think you cleared it up pretty well.

Nope: key difference is THE POSSESSION OF A COLLEGE DEGREE.

Bold and all-caps so you wouldn't miss it this time. I understand that, as a UK fan, you would overlook that part.

 

[rockycard]

Ok, i think i got it, one player goes to a particular school for 1 year for a chance to win a Championship, to play for a Hall of Fame Coach, National media exposure, and a chance to Get drafted to play in the NBA. The other Player goes to a particular School for 1 year for a chance to win a Championship, to play for a Hall of Fame RECRUITER, National media coverage, and a chance to get drafted to play in the NBA. I think you cleared it up pretty well.

Fify, he's a great recruiter, far from a great coach. Give Pitino, Self, K, Williams....32 five stars in 6 years and I guarantee that they would have more than just one championship.