Fan Negativity

[STLNBSE]

I've read these boards for many years - mostly as a diversion as I guess we all do. I know there's not nearly as much volume here as there used to be, so I'm surely painting with a broad brush and relying on a homogeneous sampling of the regular posters here, but I don't understand the pervasive pessimism on this board about CBP and the football program.

Have the last four years really been that bad? Sure, we'd all like to be making a run at the playoffs every year and improvement should be expected, but this gloom and doom about being lucky to make a bowl next year is getting intolerable. Just for chatter's sake, let's say we didn't make a bowl next year. Would that signal the beginning of our demise or provide a clear indication that CBP should be fired? Of course not.

Everyone needs to take a deep breath and realize that we have made an admirable transition from playing in CUSA, the Big East and the American Conference to being one of the better teams in the ACC - a conference near the peak of its historical performance over the last four years. A 9-4 average isn't what we want, but it's also not bad. I used to shudder thinking about our prospects in the ACC with Charlie Strong leading the charge. I felt then - and feel more certain after watching him at Texas - that we would have been begging for 8-5/9-4.

The bottom line is, we have one of the 20-25 best coaches in football even if CBP isn't the same guy he was when he was younger. Brohm will end up coaching here some day, but there's absolutely no reason to rush it when we have a good coach and a program on solid footing.

 

[DaytonCard]

I've read these boards for many years - mostly as a diversion as I guess we all do. I know there's not nearly as much volume here as there used to be, so I'm surely painting with a broad brush and relying on a homogeneous sampling of the regular posters here, but I don't understand the pervasive pessimism on this board about CBP and the football program.

Have the last four years really been that bad? Sure, we'd all like to be making a run at the playoffs every year and improvement should be expected, but this gloom and doom about being lucky to make a bowl next year is getting intolerable. Just for chatter's sake, let's say we didn't make a bowl next year. Would that signal the beginning of our demise or provide a clear indication that CBP should be fired? Of course not.

Everyone needs to take a deep breath and realize that we have made an admirable transition from playing in CUSA, the Big East and the American Conference to being one of the better teams in the ACC - a conference near the peak of its historical performance over the last four years. A 9-4 average isn't what we want, but it's also not bad. I used to shudder thinking about our prospects in the ACC with Charlie Strong leading the charge. I felt then - and feel more certain after watching him at Texas - that we would have been begging for 8-5/9-4.

The bottom line is, we have one of the 20-25 best coaches in football even if CBP isn't the same guy he was when he was younger. Brohm will end up coaching here some day, but there's absolutely no reason to rush it when we have a good coach and a program on solid footing.

I believe that your comment about Brohm coaching here is a reason so many fans are having CBP issues. Before we hand the team over let us see how Brohm does in the Big 10, he off to a great start but let us wait until year 5 and then do an evaluation.

 

[Knucklehank1]

Good observations. I think the biggest cause is the fact that Jeff Brohm is out there. If there wasn’t a great young alum coaching another program, then there would be more appreciation for Petrino’s results.

Other issues are - general negativity around UofL sports programs which is understandable. And a lot of folks not realizing the step up in class we took when we joined the ACC. Every week you are playing legitimate conference opponents.

 

[Cue Card]

Good post OP, but most of us hanging around here remember the lean years before there was even a PJCS to play in. We remember the baseball field turned football field. We remember always being looked down on because in order to get even a couple thousand people to show up, free tickets at Kroger's were up for grabs.

All of us who have grown with the program are ready for Howard's famous quote to become reality. The only variable to winning a national championship is time. Well, we now have the best path we've ever had right in front of us, and we as fans are ready. We crave it. We lust for it. A football national championship is the prize. It's there for the taking. We just have to go get it. If Petrino can't get it done, then maybe a hometown hero can. I really don't care who the coach is who gets us there. If it's Petrino then fine by me. I'm just ready for the next step on the journey because I don't know how much time I have left to wait. Lets get this done!!

Go CARDS!!!

 

[Senore2006]

Brohm's most probable future destination is coaching a Pro team. I am sure it is obvious I detest this entire thought of "Waiting for Brohm", lol. He is some people's Godot. Petrino, on a normal day, runs one of the most exciting offenses in football. As our recruiting rises - and it could take a while - and it will - we will come closer to that Championship.

I am not the slightest bit negative about our program. I think we're doing just fine.

 

[teamcanada]

We are itchy because as Howard said " the only variable is time" , and for those of us who were around then time is starting to grow short.

 

[Cardinal Cash]

As many have said we are 3 top 10 recruiting classes from winning a national championship. I know people don’t really like to hear that, but you have to recruit with the best to win the championship. It is a proven formula. If you are looking only to get to the playoff, then you just need to catch lightning in a bottle and find under the radar guys and have classes ranked in the top 20. Stranger things have happened than schools like Louisville winning the ACC (ahem Wake forest 06). But that happened to be at a time when FSU was down and Clemson was a nothing burger.

 

[CardsFirst]

I think personally a lot of the negativity this year and last year came from loses that simply shouldn’t have happened. I predicted 8-4 this year, but I didn’t expect loses to BC, WF, and we should have beat Mississippi ST. That’s where the negativity is coming from at least with my friends.

No one expects to be perfect every year but there are games we shouldn’t lose. Also the DC was a settle hire. And hasn’t proven that he can handle it yet. Although he seems to be able to recruit.

Will see how this year goes, but the schedule will be a challenge.

 

[Rollem Cards]

As many have said we are 3 top 10 recruiting classes from winning a national championship. I know people don’t really like to hear that, but you have to recruit with the best to win the championship. It is a proven formula. If you are looking only to get to the playoff, then you just need to catch lightning in a bottle and find under the radar guys and have classes ranked in the top 20. Stranger things have happened than schools like Louisville winning the ACC (ahem Wake forest 06). But that happened to be at a time when FSU was down and Clemson was a nothing burger.

There you go.

Two things are against us in recruiting. Geography and tradition.

We can never overcome our location. And without CONSISTENT top classes we will never get the tradition.

Us old farts have watched this thing build for 34 years. After the first 3’years we were mostly a big fish in a little pond. We invented money in FB (thank you TJ) that most conference mates didn’t.

Now we’ve made the BIG time and we are no longer the big fish. We are competing against 44 other wannabes that are not in the top four of there P5 conference.

Time is about up for those who started this. I truly hope to see us compete regularly for top classes and top 10 teams.

But I’m not holding my breath. But don’t get me wrong. 8–4 and top 20-25 is a hellava long way from the old Cardinal Stadium.

 

[STLNBSE]

Wake had a good team this year (beat A&M in their bowl) and a very potent offense. Frankly, they were better than us given our defensive woes. The BC game was one we absolutely let get away. Opened a big lead. Let them run it down our throats and still should have won at the end if not for Jaylen's fumble. That said, BC wasn't a bad team either. For reference, they were quite a bit better than UK.

 

[CardX]

It's likely going to be a long, dreary off season, unless the spring game shows us glimpses of hope. But, when you lose to a coachless team in your bowl game, and Alabama looms as a 26 point favorite, while 80% of the defense has departed, and you've lost your Heisman QB, yeah, there's not going to be a lot of optimism.

 

[nccardfan]

I’ll take a stab. Many felt that CBP in his first stint was directing U of L to the promise land, pinnacle or whatever you want to call it. Unfortunately he decided to pursue his own interests and left the job unfinished. Not only that, we suffered through a setback during you know who. Now with CBP in his second stint 10 years later are wondering is he our Moses? There’s not as much patience this go around for good reasons. Bobby’s own window of opportunity is getting smaller.

 

[MikeMcCammon]

BP came back with high expectations based on his success here and at Arkansas. I think a lot of people are disappointed that the team does not look as polished and prepared or as disciplined as Petrino teams usually look. Will Petrino move back to his more traditional offense with Lamar gone? Hard to say what to expect but the recruiting and player development has been a little disappointing. Having a sub par walk on center for 3 years was inexcusable. While things have not been horrible under Bobby 2.0, I also think he has lost several games he should have won and generally underachieved and fans have been somewhat disappointed.

 

[nccardfan]

BP came back with high expectations based on his success here and at Arkansas. I think a lot of people are disappointed that the team does not look as polished and prepared or as disciplined as Petrino teams usually look. Will Petrino move back to his more traditional offense with Lamar gone? Hard to say what to expect but the recruiting and player development has been a little disappointing. Having a sub par walk on center for 3 years was inexcusable. While things have not been horrible under Bobby 2.0, I also think he has lost several games he should have won and generally underachieved and fans have been somewhat disappointed.

Really? I thought he came back with his tail between his legs and should be thankful that we gave him another opportunity. Come in and finish the job you started...

 

[MikeMcCammon]

Really? I thought he came back with his tail between his legs and should be thankful that we gave him another opportunity. Come in and finish the job you started...

Not sure what that has to do with the high fan expectations. I think we may have gotten a neutered Bobby but I don't think anyone was expecting one.

 

[nccardfan]

Not sure what that has to do with the high fan expectations. I think we may have gotten a neutered Bobby but I don't think anyone was expecting one.

Right! The question was why was there fan negativity, right? You just answered the question.

 

[CardsFirst]

I think personally a lot of the negativity this year and last year came from loses that simply shouldn’t have happened. I predicted 8-4 this year, but I didn’t expect loses to BC, WF, and we should have beat Mississippi ST. That’s where the negativity is coming from at least with my friends.

No one expects to be perfect every year but there are games we shouldn’t lose. Also the DC was a settle hire. And hasn’t proven that he can handle it yet. Although he seems to be able to recruit.

Will see how this year goes, but the schedule will be a challenge.

Ok I retract my comment about him being able to recruit. Apparently he recruited 0 players. So he did absolutely nothing while he was here except collect a paycheck!

 

[wilkie01]

I've read these boards for many years - mostly as a diversion as I guess we all do. I know there's not nearly as much volume here as there used to be, so I'm surely painting with a broad brush and relying on a homogeneous sampling of the regular posters here, but I don't understand the pervasive pessimism on this board about CBP and the football program.

Have the last four years really been that bad? Sure, we'd all like to be making a run at the playoffs every year and improvement should be expected, but this gloom and doom about being lucky to make a bowl next year is getting intolerable. Just for chatter's sake, let's say we didn't make a bowl next year. Would that signal the beginning of our demise or provide a clear indication that CBP should be fired? Of course not.

Everyone needs to take a deep breath and realize that we have made an admirable transition from playing in CUSA, the Big East and the American Conference to being one of the better teams in the ACC - a conference near the peak of its historical performance over the last four years. A 9-4 average isn't what we want, but it's also not bad. I used to shudder thinking about our prospects in the ACC with Charlie Strong leading the charge. I felt then - and feel more certain after watching him at Texas - that we would have been begging for 8-5/9-4.

The bottom line is, we have one of the 20-25 best coaches in football even if CBP isn't the same guy he was when he was younger. Brohm will end up coaching here some day, but there's absolutely no reason to rush it when we have a good coach and a program on solid footing.

Ok, Bobby Petrino family!

 

[Cardinal Cash]

Petrino’s numbers are on par with what should have been the expectation moving to power 5. 9 wins should be acceptable. Charlie racked up wins with NFL guys on his roster against teams that didn’t have near the caliber of players we play week in and week out now. I think the team will improve as the last 2 years have had improved recruiting classes and hitting positions of need. We just need to have a strong and balanced class next year and hopefully get the roster loaded for 2019-2020. Next year should be heavy on the offensive line again, WRs, High School D-line, and linebackers. We should be fine at QB and Secondary, and we’ll only need 1 RB and 1TE roughly. He has us sitting at about the 3rd best program in the conference after 4 years. That is squarely where we should expect to be. Because we are more of a “rebuilding” program rather than reloading like Alabama and Clemson, we will have down years like this year with defense and possibly next year. You “reload” once you have balance on your roster and we are slowly getting there. Bobby was late to the game on the O-line and D-line. I hope he learns from his misses in the past.

 

[STLNBSE]

Ok, Bobby Petrino family!

Hmmm...doesn't really make sense. Any objective analyst of college football would call Bobby a top 25 coach.

 

[Hold Me Back]

I have always said we have some of the most educated basketball fans and some of the least educated football fans. Have we lost a handful of games we should have won? Absolutely; yes. Has CBP 2.0 been a "disappointment"? Not unless you are completely out of touch with reality.

 

[MikeMcCammon]

I have always said we have some of the most educated basketball fans and some of the least educated football fans. Have we lost a handful of games we should have won? Absolutely; yes. Has CBP 2.0 been a "disappointment"? Not unless you are completely out of touch with reality.

The reality is one could argue that we now have less talent in the program than when Petrino took over. The reality is Petrino seems to an 8-5 type coach now. The reality is the team does not have the polish and discipline we were expecting. Does that mean I want to immediately fire Petrino? No, but if we want to talk about reality, then let's be realistic.

 

[Hold Me Back]

You said in another thread that we have largely AAC talent. I went back and looked at the recruiting rankings for UL and every AAC school from 2014 - 2018, i.e. the guys that are here now, and that is not even close to reality. If i have time, I will break it down by every school and year to show how out of touch that is.

 

[MikeMcCammon]

You said in another thread that we have largely AAC talent. I went back and looked at the recruiting rankings for UL and every AAC school from 2014 - 2018, i.e. the guys that are here now, and that is not even close to reality. If i have time, I will break it down by every school and year to show how out of touch that is.

No sport. What I said was our defense has largely AAC talent. Our recruiting rankings includes our offense which clearly is not AAC level except for maybe a couple of positions. Go back and look at the offers from all of the players we played on defense. Most were low grade 3 star players. Most of them had few if any offers from power 5 conferences and if they did have some they were not good programs. Our defense clearly lacked speed and was often undersized. Our defensive backs were beaten constantly and we could rarely put pressure on opposing quarterbacks. We desperately need a talent upgrade on defense. The most talented players Petrino has had on defense are the ones he inherited from Strong.

 

[Senore2006]

Saying we need a talent upgrade on defense - particularly losing what we lose this season - is pretty much a no brainer.

Bobby's obvious bias is offense. What he needs is a defensive coordinator to match. Imagine having the Clemson DC for 4-5 years - that's the only way to view this pass.

 

[STLNBSE]

No sport. What I said was our defense has largely AAC talent. Our recruiting rankings includes our offense which clearly is not AAC level except for maybe a couple of positions. Go back and look at the offers from all of the players we played on defense. Most were low grade 3 star players. Most of them had few if any offers from power 5 conferences and if they did have some they were not good programs. Our defense clearly lacked speed and was often undersized. Our defensive backs were beaten constantly and we could rarely put pressure on opposing quarterbacks. We desperately need a talent upgrade on defense. The most talented players Petrino has had on defense are the ones he inherited from Strong.

Bad analysis. Any defense that had Thomas, Hearns, Young, Alexander, Greenard, etc shouldn't have been as bad as we were. This, of course, was due to being Sirmonized last year. Bad scheme and zero ability to motivate players. Our defense was nowhere near AAC talent level. We had better personnel than half the defensive units in the conference.

To your other point, Petrino went 9-4 his first year in the ACC despite an offense that had no line and no qb. Will Gardener, Reggie, and Bolin got all the snaps at qb that year. Scary. Strong wouldn't have made a bowl with that team playing an ACC schedule.

 

[MikeMcCammon]

Bad analysis. Any defense that had Thomas, Hearns, Young, Alexander, Greenard, etc shouldn't have been as bad as we were. This, of course, was due to being Sirmonized last year. Bad scheme and zero ability to motivate players. Our defense was nowhere near AAC talent level. We had better personnel than half the defensive units in the conference.

To your other point, Petrino went 9-4 his first year in the ACC despite an offense that had no line and no qb. Will Gardener, Reggie, and Bolin got all the snaps at qb that year. Scary. Strong wouldn't have made a bowl with that team playing an ACC schedule.

Nothing wrong with my analysis at all and it is right on target with regard to most of the players that saw the field. Obviously Alexander was injured the entire year save the opening game and Young is still getting back. Hearns was inconsistent and was not even in good shape most of the year. Not sure he even knows where the weight room is. Just because we had a precious handful of good individual players doesn't dispute what I said. What I said was factual and you don't need to analyze recruit rankings to see we were lacking in talent on defense.

 

[Hold Me Back]

Exactly...while the defense certainly requires a talent upgrade, we had the players to field at least a respectable defense last season. Now, of course Bobby has to take some heat for hiring who he did. No arguments there.

 

[mwatson61]

Bobby’s recruiting at a better clip than any previous coach. He adjusted his offense to meet the talents of LJ and the kid earned a Heisman. Nobody saw that coming 3 years ago. The majority of the programs in the ACC especially Clemson have invested huge amounts into their training facilities even Purdue now has one of the nicest facilities in the Big 10. While we were on the forefront 20 years ago when Papa John’s opened, we were passed by programs like UK in training facilities. All of these things take time and money. Thanks to TJ, our new facilities will soon be up there with some of the best. It’s always an arms race in college football and I don’t buy the geography excuse. How many kids from Florida and Georgia have come to Louisville in the past? Hundreds! We now have the coach, the facilities and the conference to take the final steps we all dream of. Like many, I’ve been around since Lee Corso and it’s been an amazing journey. As far as Bobby’s age, like me he’s only 56 years old and has a lot of fire and desire to take us to the promised land.

 

[MikeMcCammon]

Bobby’s recruiting at a better clip than any previous coach.

Why shouldn't he? He has all the advantages no one else ever had regarding better conference affiliation and bigger stadium. Unfortunately he still has less talent and depth in the program than he had the first time he was here and arguably less than he inherited from Strong.

 

[Hold Me Back]

Why shouldn't he? He has all the advantages no one else ever had regarding better conference affiliation and bigger stadium. Unfortunately he still has less talent and depth in the program than he had the first time he was here and arguably less than he inherited from Strong.

Again, not accurate. Outside of the 2006 team, which was arguably the best in school history, we have had more talent and depth than CBP's first tenure. Of course, we are now playing the likes of Clemson, Florida State, etc. as opposed to West Virginia, Rutgers, and South Florida.

 

[STLNBSE]

Why shouldn't he? He has all the advantages no one else ever had regarding better conference affiliation and bigger stadium. Unfortunately he still has less talent and depth in the program than he had the first time he was here and arguably less than he inherited from Strong.

Have to also disagree with this. What metric are you using to gauge the "more talent" narrative during his first tenure? If you say the eyeball test, I guess you are entitled to that opinion as wrong as it may be.

Its easy to look super talented while waxing Cincinnati and Tulane. Bobbys old teams were good but they also lost to USF, Memphis, Rutgers, on occasion. We certainly didn't have any Lamar Jacksons.

 

[MikeMcCammon]

Have to also disagree with this. What metric are you using to gauge the "more talent" narrative during his first tenure? If you say the eyeball test, I guess you are entitled to that opinion as wrong as it may be.

Its easy to look super talented while waxing Cincinnati and Tulane. Bobbys old teams were good but they also lost to USF, Memphis, Rutgers, on occasion. We certainly didn't have any Lamar Jacksons.

Seems easy enough. Two of 1.0's teams finished in the top 6 in the country and a third in the top 20. He also produced tons of NFL talent. In 2006 he lost arguably the best player in the country in the first game of the season and still almost won the national title. 2.0 is not in the same class. Not even close.

 

[teamcanada]

Seems easy enough. Two of 1.0's teams finished in the top 6 in the country and a third in the top 20. He also produced tons of NFL talent. In 2006 he lost arguably the best player in the country in the first game of the season and still almost won the national title. 2.0 is not in the same class. Not even close.

What was the schedule difficulty ranked back then?My eyeball test says the competition level the Cards are playing has stepped up.

 

[STLNBSE]

Seems easy enough. Two of 1.0's teams finished in the top 6 in the country and a third in the top 20. He also produced tons of NFL talent. In 2006 he lost arguably the best player in the country in the first game of the season and still almost won the national title. 2.0 is not in the same class. Not even close.

Again...level of competition was way different but I agree with you about the 2006 team being awesome. Not sure what the NFL numbers are for his first 4 compared to his last four....do you?

 

[MikeMcCammon]

Again, not accurate. Outside of the 2006 team, which was arguably the best in school history, we have had more talent and depth than CBP's first tenure. Of course, we are now playing the likes of Clemson, Florida State, etc. as opposed to West Virginia, Rutgers, and South Florida.

LOL! West Virginia, the team that we played in 2005 and 2006, the team that defeated the SEC champ and Big 12 champ in bowl games was comparable to any team we have played in the ACC. Their offense was just that good. The 2006 schedule was comparable to any schedule we have played in the ACC. Regardless we are talking about talent and not schedules. There is no team that Bobby 2.0 has put on the field that can compare to our 2004 and 2006 teams. Good grief man, Mike Bush was considered the third best running back on the 2004 team. Do you think we have had offensive lines and running backs that have compared to Shelton, Gates and Bush on the 2.0 teams? You are being silly.

 

[MikeMcCammon]

Again...level of competition was way different but I agree with you about the 2006 team being awesome. Not sure what the NFL numbers are for his first 4 compared to his last four....do you?

The level of competition difference was not as great as some want to claim. Outside of Clemson who has been consistently top notch? Ton of players had good careers off the 1.0 teams on both offense and defense. Some are still hanging around. Most of the NFL talent recently were Strong's players, not Petrino's. His recruiting has been terrible for the most part especially on defense.

 

[Hold Me Back]

I feel like I am arguing with Kellyanne Conway and "alternative facts". The schedules are not comparable, not even close. While we did play some good teams during Bobby 1.0 we always had a breather of playing a few teams we simply outclassed between big games. Nothing like the ACC where even the cellar dwellers have good players up and down the roster (Syracuse beating Clemson, for example).

 

[Hold Me Back]

Also, you seem to agree with a poster above that Bobby has been recruiting better than any previous coach by saying, "why shouldn't he?" Then you say his recruiting has been terrible. You're all over the place, man.

 

[STLNBSE]

Also, you seem to agree with a poster above that Bobby has been recruiting better than any previous coach by saying, "why shouldn't he?" Then you say his recruiting has been terrible. You're all over the place, man.

This. Dude makes random assertions. There's a name for that...it's called dogma. Anyone who understands anything about big time football knows the huge difference in the schedules. I think 1.0 and those teams would have done well in the ACC but they wouldn't just clean up. And the comment about our NFL guys during 2.0 being Stongs guys is bogus. As many during 1.0 were John Ls guys if he wants to go down that path.