Elephant in the room

[tluck28]

I KNOW I am going to get bashed for this, however it is a legitimate concern or question.... How come some athletes, especially college, do not get speech lessons? I hear some of our athletes speak and I wonder how they made it through school, better yet, are in college.

I love our players but this is an educational institution. We have one of our players about to receive one of the biggest awards on the planet and I often wonder what his speech to the country will be like. Do we have speech classes available to our athletes? I remember the Montrez Harrel days...he would be on the radio and I literally could not understand a word he was saying, or "shouting" into the microphone.

 

[Kratz]

Political correctness. Different types of speech are the norm within certain groups. To tell them to "speak properly" is translated into "speak like a white person" and is an insult to their culture.

I take it you're not old enough to remember when the ebonics and spanglish debates were going on across the country?

One shining example of what you're talking about was Derek Smith. He saw his first interview on tape and said he was literally embarrassed at how poorly he spoke. He took speech and communications classes throughout the rest of his career at UofL just to improve his speaking ability.

 

[OmegaCard]

This board has no elephants. Just fluff.

 

[Ipartiedwithhopgood]

The athletes come from different parts of the country and with that comes different drawls. Does not mean they do not belong in the institutions.

 

[tluck28]

Political correctness. Different types of speech are the norm within certain groups. To tell them to "speak properly" is translated into "speak like a white person" and is an insult to their culture.

I take it you're not old enough to remember when the ebonics and spanglish debates were going on across the country?

One shining example of what you're talking about was Derek Smith. He saw his first interview on tape and said he was literally embarrassed at how poorly he spoke. He took speech and communications classes throughout the rest of his career at UofL just to improve his speaking ability.

Yea..I know we don't know each other...but I absolutely HATE political correctness and think it is a parasite to our country. Aside from that, Id just like to be able to understand someone. Educated people do not speak like some of these athletes speak. These are college institutions and we have kids who cant speak and tweet out sentences with the absolute worst grammar that you could imagine. Its kind of crazy actually if you think about it.

 

[tluck28]

I understand people have accents ....it is not the "accents" in which I am talking about. Hell, I have an accent as many of us probably do. I know this is a touchy subject, especially for our liberal folks here. I am sure there is a safe place somewhere for anyone who feels offended, or some kind of pin you can wear.

It is a serious question though. I hear some of these kids speak and I feel a little embarrassed for them. I often think, gosh I hope sports works out for you because speaking like that you wont be getting too far anywhere else.

My point is, these kids are in big time programs where they have to speak to the country. I would imagine a simple speech class would be good for some. I cant remember ever hearing players from Duke or UNC sounding like this, and that goes for all, black, white, and brown.

 

[The Public Enemy]

Wait until you hear LSU Coach Ed Orgeron....

 

[CardX]

I KNOW I am going to get bashed for this, however it is a legitimate concern or question.... How come some athletes, especially college, do not get speech lessons? I hear some of our athletes speak and I wonder how they made it through school, better yet, are in college.

I love our players but this is an educational institution. We have one of our players about to receive one of the biggest awards on the planet and I often wonder what his speech to the country will be like. Do we have speech classes available to our athletes? I remember the Montrez Harrel days...he would be on the radio and I literally could not understand a word he was saying, or "shouting" into the microphone.

I think we should all be the same, act the same, speak the same, etc. That would be great. Regarding Lamar, it's not like he speaks ghetto or anything. He's soft spoken with a hint of a southern drawl.

 

[wreckcard#22]

it's not so much of an accent as a completely different dialect...Mexicans think Puerto Ricans can't speak proper Spanish, can't even understand them at times...Spaniards think they are all wrong.

Point is, when a group of people are isolated they come up with their own culture, that includes unique language...there does have to be some common ground however, and it's important for any person who is trying to assimilate to a different culture (read: south Florida black to metropolitan college white) to adopt similar speech patterns for the purpose of improved communications.

This takes time and practice and it's really flippin hard to change a lifetime of speech patterns, of course that assumes he even wants too...he could very well have a attitude of "if you want to understand me, you just need to learn how to understand me"...and for very good reason, he has a skill set that makes him very marketable as it is...why go through the trouble if it isn't necessary.

Yeah, I'm a liberal.

 

[Ipartiedwithhopgood]

I don't think any of the responses reflect being offended. People are just sharing their opinions on a thread you created, which would be what is assumed you were hoping for when you created the thread - conversation, and points of view.

Your reference to Duke and UNC is funny. None of their players are doing national interviews in this sport, so that's the biggest reason why you can't remember any of their players giving bad interviews - because they haven't given any interviews.

Another way for you to cope with what you hear would be to not listen to their interviews. That would solve your problem.

 

[BPGhost]

First of all, UofL does have speech / public speaking classes that they guide their student-athletes to. Do you remember how unpolished Teddy was when he first came here? Now the guy sounds like a CEO and the Vikings are thrilled to have him as the face of the franchise. UofL will help LJ in the same way with being more comfortable in front of the camera.

Secondly, taking my cue from you about not being PC - I don't think you give a damn about how LJ speaks except that somehow it embarrasses you as a UofL fan, as if it somehow reflects on you and what team you choose to support.

And while it doesn't reflect on you, it sure says something about you...

 

[tluck28]

If he was a UK player everyone would be singing a different tune. I still remember the Bledsoe days....

 

[Rollem Cards]

Very few people speak 100% correctly. LJ just needs to slow down (but that doesn't seem to be his nature )

It is in all kids' interest to better themselves in all facets of life. Some will. Some won't

My pet peeve is using the word "like" as like every other word. I won't hire a person who does. So like am I like a racist or like just a dinosaur?

I may miss the most qualified person in the world, but like I don't care.

It will never happen in the liberal arts world of higher education, but along with basic US History, there should be a mandatory fr class on just everyday stuff that will get you a job. Speech, language, dress, personal hygiene, etc.

But, as Jeff Walz said, that's not today's way.

 

[ULGrad09]

At the end of the day top tier athletes, the ones that end up being interviewed and face the media, spend the majority of their time perfecting what put them in position to be interviewed in the first place. Lamar Jackson does not spend the majority of his time in the classroom or with communications tutors, he is working to improve his draft status, which will be his career, not speaking at conventions, making public service announcements, etc.

The only thing I care about with regards to Lamar's education, as well as other top tier athletes at UofL, is that they do not get in bad academic standing which will remove them from sporting events.

Bottom line is this, I went to school at UofL and focused in the classroom because that was what I had to do to improve my career ceiling. The athletes that play for us, focus on sports which is their hopeful career.

 

[Steelers2012]

My best guess is that most of the high profile athletes at any university (ones expected to be in front of the camera/microphone) DO get help with communication throughout their collegiate career. Same with appearance for athlete's, if they are expected to one day play for a living. Have you ever noticed how many of our high profile athletes get braces during their time at Louisville? Jackson's collegiate career is still quite young. He is still a marketing work in progress. I have a feeling he will be well prepared to give his Heisman acceptance speech. Not Bono great, but certainly well enough to appear confident and understandable in this particular spotlight.

 

[OmegaCard]

I love the way LJ ends his conversation. He raises his eyebrow and nods his head in agreement to what he just said. A little Bernie Mac-esq.

 

[Kratz]

Yeah, Bledsoe was probably about the worst I've seen in the modern generation. Probably needed closed captioning to understand every word he said.

 

[clearthebases]

Yeah, Bledsoe was probably about the worst I've seen in the modern generation. Probably needed closed captioning to understand every word he said.

Give him a break, he was a majoring in algebra not English.

 

[Cue Card]

My best guess is that most of the high profile athletes at any university (ones expected to be in front of the camera/microphone) DO get help with communication throughout their collegiate career. Same with appearance for athlete's, if they are expected to one day play for a living. Have you ever noticed how many of our high profile athletes get braces during their time at Louisville? Jackson's collegiate career is still quite young. He is still a marketing work in progress. I have a feeling he will be well prepared to give his Heisman acceptance speech. Not Bono great, but certainly well enough to appear confident and understandable in this particular spotlight.

I just hope he wins the award. He earned it and he deserves it. He was by far the most exciting, and BEST college football player playing in division 1. I would really hate it if he was screwed out of it based on the results of the last two games in spite of having almost 700 total yards of offense and 5 touchdowns. IMO, nobody is even close to him for this award. It should be his.

 

[BPGhost]

Give him a break, he was a majoring in algebra not English.

I'm pretty sure that he was able to test out of all of his college math requirements given his outstanding work in those online HS courses.

 

[KingHenry_X]

Any analysis, talk of culture or race, is simply nonsense thought up by people who feel offended by being corrected and do not wish to put forth the effort to conform to societal norms. Being well-spoken and articulate is not a black or white thing. Either you are an effective communicator or you are not. Go tell Morgan Freeman or James Earl Jones that they "need to talk more black". If being well-spoken is a white thing, do people in trailor parks and Portland speak like they are going yachting on the weekend? Implying that communicating effectively has anything to do with race or that one should not have to correct inaccuracies, grammar, etc. because that is who they are is in itself racist. You know the saying, you can take the person out of the trailer park/ghetto, but you can't take the trailer park/ghetto out of the person. Is that where we are? No standard for excellence? No goal to acheive? How low are we going to continue to lower the bar to accommodate those that don't want to put forth the effort?

This goes back to what Coach Walz was ranting about. The same people that justify poor communication skills as being cultural or racial, are the same ones that claim standardized tests benefit one race over another - as if math, sciences and reading and writing are racially biased. You either know the right answer or you don't. But what do we do? We lower the bar so everyone is happy with their score and adjust our entire educational curriculum to teach toward prepping for these tests which should be nothing more than a barometer. Schools systems start focusing all resources on finding ways to elevate their scores for fear of funding or other consequences being levied.

"Don't correct me, this is a message board not an english essay!"

Bar lowered.

"Don't criticize, that is his racial culture"

Bar lowered.

Making excuses for ANYONE of any race or culture for not meeting an expectation is the ultimate example of deep-seeded racism because you imply that someone of another race or culture is not capable of meeting those expectations and that we are not all equal underneath the skin.

The reason you go to a university and not a trade school is to get a rounded education and exposure to culture. If you are college educated, you should be expected to act and communicate accordingly. Dragging down an institution of higher learning to your level because you don't want to put forth the effort is simply laziness at the highest degree and paving the way for others like you to do the same.

FWIW, I don't have a problem understanding Lamar, he just mumbles too much. Ed Orgeron, however...good lord!

 

[Kratz]

Orgeron is a cajun. Takes awhile to catch on to creole. I used to work with a guy that spoke a lot of creole. Interesting to say the least.

 

[KingHenry_X]

Orgeron is a cajun. Takes awhile to catch on to creole. I used to work with a guy that spoke a lot of creole. Interesting to say the least.

I know he is. I've spent enough time in Leesville and Ft. Polk to understand him. But if he is speaking to the media, he is not speaking to a world of people who do. Same goes for anyone speaking into a microphone to a large audience. All the more reason to be articulate.

 

[Cue Card]

Making excuses for ANYONE of any race or culture for not meeting an expectation is the ultimate example of deep-seeded racism because you imply that someone of another race or culture is not capable of meeting those expectations and that we are not all equal underneath the skin.

Well stated. Head, meet Nail.

 

[The Public Enemy]

I know he is. I've spent enough time in Leesville and Ft. Polk to understand him. But if he is speaking to the media, he is not speaking to a world of people who do. Same goes for anyone speaking into a microphone to a large audience. All the more reason to be articulate.

JRTC & Fort Polk....my last duty station...they even have a morning news broadcast in creole...different world...lol

 

[wreckcard#22]

Any analysis, talk of culture or race, is simply nonsense thought up by people who feel offended by being corrected and do not wish to put forth the effort to conform to societal norms

um, you're an idiot; and based on your generalizations, likely a racist as well...just trying to be not PC per the trend on this thread.

Keeping it real...respect

If you don't want to think, that's your business; but calling out people who do as overly sensitive and lazy is evidence of your inability to understand abstract concepts.

 

[KingHenry_X]

um, you're an idiot; and based on your generalizations, likely a racist as well...just trying to be not PC per the trend on this thread.

Keeping it real...respect

If you don't want to think, that's your business; but calling out people who do as overly sensitive and lazy is evidence of your inability to understand abstract concepts.

Is that what it is? "Abstract concepts"? ROFLMAO, you keep telling yourself that. Keep that bar low little fella. You can do it! You're the best!

 

[Cue Card]

um, you're an idiot; and based on your generalizations, likely a racist as well...just trying to be not PC per the trend on this thread.

Keeping it real...respect

If you don't want to think, that's your business; but calling out people who do as overly sensitive and lazy is evidence of your inability to understand abstract concepts.

I like this topic. It makes people think. I'm not overly sensitive but I am lazy yet I do understand abstract concepts.

I'm a mutt.

 

[BPGhost]

Any analysis, talk of culture or race, is simply nonsense thought up by people who feel offended by being corrected and do not wish to put forth the effort to conform to societal norms. Being well-spoken and articulate is not a black or white thing. Either you are an effective communicator or you are not. Go tell Morgan Freeman or James Earl Jones that they "need to talk more black". If being well-spoken is a white thing, do people in trailor parks and Portland speak like they are going yachting on the weekend? Implying that communicating effectively has anything to do with race or that one should not have to correct inaccuracies, grammar, etc. because that is who they are is in itself racist. You know the saying, you can take the person out of the trailer park/ghetto, but you can't take the trailer park/ghetto out of the person. Is that where we are? No standard for excellence? No goal to acheive? How low are we going to continue to lower the bar to accommodate those that don't want to put forth the effort?

This goes back to what Coach Walz was ranting about. The same people that justify poor communication skills as being cultural or racial, are the same ones that claim standardized tests benefit one race over another - as if math, sciences and reading and writing are racially biased. You either know the right answer or you don't. But what do we do? We lower the bar so everyone is happy with their score and adjust our entire educational curriculum to teach toward prepping for these tests which should be nothing more than a berometer. Schools systems start focusing all resources on finding ways to elevate their scores for fear of funding or other consequences being levied.

"Don't correct me, this is a message board not an english essay!"

Bar lowered.

"Don't criticize, that is his racial culture"

Bar lowered.

Making excuses for ANYONE of any race or culture for not meeting an expectation is the ultimate example of deep-seeded racism because you imply that someone of another race or culture is not capable of meeting those expectations and that we are not all equal underneath the skin.

The reason you go to a university and not a trade school is to get a rounded education and exposure to culture. If you are college educated, you should be expected to act and communicate accordingly. Dragging down an institution of higher learning to your level because you don't want to put forth the effort is simply laziness at the highest degree and paving the way for others like you to do the same.

FWIW, I don't have a problem understanding Lamar, he just mumbles too much. Ed Orgeron, however...good lord!

In the interest of keeping the bar high - you misspelled barometer.

Additionally, extolling the virtues of not lowering said bar or expecting a "standard of excellence" does not have to be mutually exclusive from the realization that someone's economic status plays a large part in their ease or difficulty in achievement.

 

[Ipartiedwithhopgood]

Is that what it is? "Abstract concepts"? ROFLMAO, you keep telling yourself that. Keep that bar low little fella. You can do it! Your the best!

It's, "You're" the best!

 

[KingHenry_X]

You see how sensitive people are by just mentioning accuracy in spelling or grammar? They instantly go into attack mode. "How dare you correct me and my lack of attention to detail!"

My reaction is the complete opposite: Thank you for the correction, I will now go back an edit my inaccuracies. Then what do you have? Not a point to make?

 

[wreckcard#22]

Is that what it is? "Abstract concepts"? ROFLMAO, you keep telling yourself that. Keep that bar low little fella. You can do it! Your the best!

yes, culture is an abstract concept...sorry, that was probably unfamiliar lexicon for you...I'll take your advice and lower the bar when communicating with you from now on.

darn, I did it again...your lexicon is the language you typically use.

hope that clarifies it for you.

again, one has to try to assimilate to the culture for the purpose of improved communication...I should have taken my own advice.

dang it...assimilate means to absorb and integrate...and communication means to use language to share ideas. (don't want to assume anything).

Language is also an abstract concept.

glad you got a laugh though, especially one that removed part of your a$$...I suspect you've got plenty to lose.

 

[Morgantown Card]

I KNOW I am going to get bashed for this, however it is a legitimate concern or question.... How come some athletes, especially college, do not get speech lessons? I hear some of our athletes speak and I wonder how they made it through school, better yet, are in college.

I love our players but this is an educational institution. We have one of our players about to receive one of the biggest awards on the planet and I often wonder what his speech to the country will be like. Do we have speech classes available to our athletes? I remember the Montrez Harrel days...he would be on the radio and I literally could not understand a word he was saying, or "shouting" into the microphone.

I remember when Randy Moss was in college. He wasn't allowed to talk on camera and with good reason. I remember reading an interview with him and it wasn't slang or accent that was an issue. The issues were proper subject-verb agreement, double-negatives, constant use of "like" etc etc. Today, Randy has a nice career doing sports analysis and he sounds great.

If I went into meetings saying "I ain't got none" and "I seen such and such" I probably would not get very far in my career. I get culture and slang and all that, but you can't get in front of people and say gems like "I ain't got none" and not have people snicker. It absolutely has something to do with upbringing and education, and doesn't have a damn thing to do with skin color unless people want to redirect conversation.

If you are a scholarship athlete, I don't want to hear about how you "seen a good play" during film study, lol.

 

[KingHenry_X]

Additionally, extolling the virtues of not lowering said bar or expecting a "standard of excellence" does not have to be mutually exclusive from the realization that someone's economic status plays a large part in their ease or difficulty in achievement.

You keep selling that. Only the ignorant are buying. Ease and difficulty in acheivement? So, instead of extolling the virtues of hard work, perseverance, hope, and making the right choices in life, you choose to propagate a resentment for people who have what they don't have but think they deserve what they didn't earn? This society will continue to degenerate as long as people like you spread that BS on bread and call it applebutter. Everyone faces challenges. Some may have come from a better economic background, but if they only work half as hard as one from a lower economic background, they will not climb as high. Period. To believe otherwise is to take away the very drive that built America into what it became in the 20th. To perpetuate the notion that people on high will remain on high and others will be trampled under foot is taking away someone's dream and will before they even start. Is that your goal? Are you a big Alinsky fan? Keep the minorities down and pissed off to do your bidding?

Someone receiving a college education for free no matter what their "economic background" is still receiving a college education. Their will, drive and determination determines their success - not their parents' bank account.

 

[KingHenry_X]

yes, culture is an abstract concept...sorry, that was probably unfamiliar lexicon for you...I'll take your advice and lower the bar when communicating with you from now on.

darn, I did it again...your lexicon is the language you typically use.

hope that clarifies it for you.

again, one has to try to assimilate to the culture for the purpose of improved communication...I should have taken my own advice.

dang it...assimilate means to absorb and integrate...and communication means to use language to share ideas. (don't want to assume anything).

Language is also an abstract concept.

glad you got a laugh though, especially one that removed part of your a$$...I suspect you've got plenty to lose.

Please skool me on these things. ive never been outside jefferson county and dont no wat da wurld iz lik.

 

[wreckcard#22]

Please skool me on these things. ive never been outside jefferson county and dont no wat da wurld iz lik.

I think I understand what you did there...you're the one who didn't understand what I said, I clarified...this whole topic is on communication.

I called you an idiot based on what you said, not how you said it...do you get it now?

 

[KingHenry_X]

I think I understand what you did there...you're the one who didn't understand what I said, I clarified...this whole topic is on communication.

I called you an idiot based on what you said, not how you said it...do you get it now?

Oh, I get I think I get it now. You are an idiot, and you embrace your idiocy and think your idiocy should be accepted by all because your idiocy is a part of your race or cultural background? Got it.

 

[TDredbird]

Yea..I know we don't know each other...but I absolutely HATE political correctness and think it is a parasite to our country. Aside from that, Id just like to be able to understand someone. Educated people do not speak like some of these athletes speak. These are college institutions and we have kids who cant speak and tweet out sentences with the absolute worst grammar that you could imagine. Its kind of crazy actually if you think about it.

Get over yourself. I see terrible grammar on EVERY message board I visit, including this one.

 

[TDredbird]

If he was a UK player everyone would be singing a different tune. I still remember the Bledsoe days....

He was such a math prodigy that nobody cared. Being so far advanced, I am sure he wasn't required to take algebra at all. Probably started out in calculus. Lol.

 

[BPGhost]

You keep selling that. Only the ignorant are buying. Ease and difficulty in acheivement? So, instead of extolling the virtues of hard work, perseverance, hope, and making the right choices in life, you choose to propagate a resentment for people who have what they don't have but think they deserve what they didn't earn? This society will continue to degenerate as long as people like you spread that BS on bread and call it applebutter. Everyone faces challenges. Some may have come from a better economic background, but if they only work half as hard as one from a lower economic background, they will not climb as high. Period. To believe otherwise is to take away the very drive that built America into what it became in the 20th. To perpetuate the notion that people on high will remain on high and others will be trampled under foot is taking away someone's dream and will before they even start. Is that your goal? Are you a big Alinsky fan? Keep the minorities down and pissed off to do your bidding?

Someone receiving a college education for free no matter what their "economic background" is still receiving a college education. Their will, drive and determination determines their success - not their parents' bank account.

So rather than actually reading and attempting to understand what I posted, you decided to go the other way. Having a discussion with individuals who don't listen to the other person because they're so busy formulating their comeback, is typically unproductive but, I'll give it one more shot.

You failed to notice but in my original post, I agreed with you that striving to be the best you can be, should be a desired thing in our society. My point was that you can still hold that belief and also recognize that everyone does not start at the same place in the race. If you start off poor, you face a more difficult road to success than if you start off wealthy - that's just common sense. It absolutely doesn't mean that tough economic circumstances preclude failure anymore than advantageous ones predict success. But if you don't think that not having enough to eat or, having a stable home life don't negatively affect your pathway to success, well I'm not sure what to tell you.