Cards Fans, We Have A Problem

[shadow force]

This has been an inexplicable collapse these last couple of games, which includes one of the worst halves I've seen today.

Last year, this happened after the Duke loss but this year what is the reason? I'm not giving up on them by any means but this is trending toward a place I didn't want to revisit again so soon.

 

[Cue Card]

This has been an inexplicable collapse these last couple of games, which includes one of the worst halves I've seen today.

Last year, this happened after the Duke loss but this year what is the reason? I'm not giving up on them by any means but this is trending toward a place I didn't want to revisit again so soon.

No clue what's happened but there are only a handful of games left before the post season starts. Mack better fix this ASAP. This team is way more talented than they've shown the last 2 games.

 

[Steelers2012]

Last year’s late season depression started on February 2, and they finished out 4-9 the rest of the season. The motto to start this season was “Finish”. Time will tell if this team is able to get their act together to avoid whimpering the season away again, but right now, it’s not looking good.

 

[Ipartiedwithhopgood]

There is history of teams limping to the wire then heating up in March unexpectedly. It's just hard to know what these guys are going to do.

 

[Cardiac Red]

It's just hard to know what these guys are going to do.

There has been ZERO sign these guys are going to be different than what they've been.. Nwora is the problem. Probably why he didn't start. Something is going on..

 

[Mike'sMarbles]

I know it's small consolation, but this seems to be the nature of college basketball, at least this year. Look at some of the other games today:

#22 Illinois loses at Rutgers.
Syracuse almost beat FSU today at FSU.
Ole Miss almost beat UK at Rupp.
Georgetown (15-10) won at #19 Butler
#24 Texas Tech loses at rebuilding Oklahoma State (13-12)
#25 LSU loses at 14-11 Alabama

And it's not like today is over yet, there is potential for even more.

 

[Cardiac Red]

I know it's small consolation, but this seems to be the nature of college basketball, at least this year. Look at some of the other games today:

#22 Illinois loses at Rutgers.
Syracuse almost beat FSU today at FSU.
Ole Miss almost beat UK at Rupp.
Georgetown (15-10) won at #19 Butler
#24 Texas Tech loses at rebuilding Oklahoma State (13-12)
#25 LSU loses at 14-11 Alabama

And it's not like today is over yet, there is potential for even more.

You're right, small consolation..

 

[PHCARD]

I can remember many years when another BB coach was blamed for these type of slumps. He worked them too hard, etc etc.

 

[LeFors4Ever]

I can remember many years when another BB coach was blamed for these type of slumps. He worked them too hard, etc etc.

But to be fair, Rick had a track record of success. Before Louisville he had taken 2 schools to the Final 4 and won a title. He’d also taken an NBA team to the playoffs.

But I don’t blame Mack. I think this group is a bunch of over achievers. We overachieved so much last year that it got the hype further last year. And the overachieving is because of coaching.

We just assumed this freshman class would add to the players we had coming back and we’d roll. But we’re a bit limited on what we have.

Ryan McMahon, Dwayne Sutton, and Fresh Kimble are mid-major talents that Mack is getting a bunch out of right now. Nwora is a draft pick and is still a top scorer in the nation. Sutton was a transfer. Malik and Perry are juniors who were 4 stars, but I can’t blame Mack as the aren’t his guys and Malik plays well. Sam and DJ are freshman, not elite freshman but just good. This is a strange roster and has some limits. A lot of players who can play, but they don’t fit right now.

It’s a mixed group of Rick’s leftovers, transfers, and six freshman. We don’t have a point guard right now. This freshman group re-energized our program and we’ll see the benefits of them as the years go on.

Mack is gonna be a fine coach, I think the high expectations for this team are a result of how good of a coach he was to come in and turn it around so quick.

 

[Ipartiedwithhopgood]

There has been ZERO sign these guys are going to be different than what they've been.. Nwora is the problem. Probably why he didn't start. Something is going on..

Oh I don't disagree, it doesn't look good. Absolutely no argument. Yo, it COULD get WORSE LOL! They are positioning themselves into a tough 1st round opponent somewhere in the 10 - 13 seed range.

Or they could steal a game in March, find themselves in a bracket that fell apart, and suddenly give fans an unexpected post season run.

I just have no idea.

 

[Cardiac Red]

Or they could steal a game in March, find themselves in a bracket that fell apart, and suddenly give fans an unexpected post season run.

Think this is what we better hope for.

 

[KerryRhodes]

I can remember many years when another BB coach was blamed for these type of slumps. He worked them too hard, etc etc.

.
Well these are "another" coaches players.

Coach Mack is just finishing up his 2nd year. Patience

 

[Thecycle27]

This is an easy team to scout. It is becoming really apparent force them off the 3pt line. They can’t drive by you, they aren’t willing passers and they will force shots.

How in the world they light up Virginia and turn around with these 2 performances. Hard to explain.

 

[yum center]

This team has absolutely no heart. They just stand around on defense. It's like they're afraid of contact or afraid they're going to foul. This group simply cannot play the pack line defense because of their lack of toughness. If I were Mack I'd be playing zone from here on out and would occasionally extend it full court.

 

[PHCARD]

.
Well these are "another" coaches players.

Coach Mack is just finishing up his 2nd year. Patience

My point is it happens this time of year. It’s only our 5th loss. I remember the same grumblings way before Mack.

 

[zipp]

I like Mack. But he’s been to one Elite Eight, and that record may remain intact.

This team is largely what it was last year plus Johnson and Williamson. That’s better, but it’s TBD how much better.

Maybe the circumstances are different, but this is the second time in two years that we’re fading in the stretch. I doubt Mack has a clue why.

The “Pitino’s players” vs “Mack’s players “ argument is IMO mostly hope and rationalization. The guys Mack is bringing in look like different versions of what we have been recruiting. I’m fine with that, but Mack is responsible for molding them into something more than the sum of their parts. At the moment, we’re not even that...

 

[achilles992000]

agree with the poster who said we are too easy to scout. opponents have to spread out the offense and use screens. defensively they have to guard against 3 pointers.

Mack has to change the way we switch on defense in man to man and use zone in first half. offensively, we have to cut to the basket. do some pick and roll, screens, and move Nwora around. jmo.

 

[KerryRhodes]

I like Mack. But he’s been to one Elite Eight, and that record may remain intact.

This team is largely what it was last year plus Johnson and Williamson. That’s better, but it’s TBD how much better.

Maybe the circumstances are different, but this is the second time in two years that we’re fading in the stretch. I doubt Mack has a clue why.

The “Pitino’s players” vs “Mack’s players “ argument is IMO mostly hope and rationalization. The guys Mack is bringing in look like different versions of what we have been recruiting. I’m fine with that, but Mack is responsible for molding them into something more than the sum of their parts. At the moment, we’re not even that...

Welcome back Z.

Missed ya during that 10 game winn streak.
UofL must be losing.............

 

[PushupMan]

Since we’re having trouble getting off to a fast start, I’d break out the full court man-to-man press. It would help our offensive inefficiency to get a few steals and layups. If necessary, go with a small lineup with 3 or 4 guards.

 

[vivid_red]

I think we should press more a well, get some hustle baskets

 

[zipp]

Welcome back Z.

Missed ya during that 10 game winn streak.
UofL must be losing.............

I didn’t have to say anything in defense of basketball when fans were climbing all over each other for Final Four tix...

 

[Cardiac Red]

Since we’re having trouble getting off to a fast start, I’d break out the full court man-to-man press. It would help our offensive inefficiency to get a few steals and layups. If necessary, go with a small lineup with 3 or 4 guards.

Man I really agree with this. It would probably help the guys get more engaged with the game starting out too.

 

[LeFors4Ever]

agree with the poster who said we are too easy to scout. opponents have to spread out the offense and use screens. defensively they have to guard against 3 pointers.

Mack has to change the way we switch on defense in man to man and use zone in first half. offensively, we have to cut to the basket. do some pick and roll, screens, and move Nwora around. jmo.

it’s not that we’re easy to scout, it’s just what kind of offense do we run? To be honest it’s been get hot from 3 or just out-man teams with less talent.

There just isn’t a flow. There’s no set play or shot that I know will work. When you think of this team, you just think Ryan or Jordan get hot from 3 and now DJ driving to the cup. I don’t see a cohesive offense. No set plays.

And it’s because we don’t really have a floor General. We change roles every game. DJ is doing great now, but what happens when teams find an adjustment to keep him out of the lane? Can we adjust, because that’s the only big issue I’ve seen in these Mack years, we don’t adjust.

 

[Tenncard]

.
Well these are "another" coaches players.

Coach Mack is just finishing up his 2nd year. Patience

But next year is this team, minus Nwora, Sutton, Enoch, and Fresh. Not confidence inspiring.

 

[KerryRhodes]

I didn’t have to say anything in defense of basketball when fans were climbing all over each other for Final Four tix...

Not us.
We saw the flaws.
I said elite 8.

This team doesnt play hard for 40 minutes. We all knew that they needed to take the next step to be a F4 contender, despite the talk of a #1 seed.

Theres alot of fans that want Coach Mack fired. Theyre idiots.

I still think this team can get to the elite 8.

 

[nccardfan]

I haven’t heard any fans wanting him fired. At least not on this message board.

 

[ULdoug]

So, i don't get the"not Macks players " thing. Of course their his players. He's their coach, and has been for 2 seasons. Also don't get saying we don't have talent. We have 9 four star players on this roster. And we have 7 experienced upperclassmen. And 2 solid freshman.... making us 9 deep. In a down year for college bball , We have more talent, experience, size, and depth than these teams we're losing to except UK. So we still have every right to be a factor. Let's see how it unfolds.

 

[zipp]

Satterfield seemed to do pretty well this past year with kids he didn't recruit.

And Mack's not bringing in any better players than Pitino did. (I'm fine with that BTW because talent is not the solution to our problems IMO...)

 

[LeFors4Ever]

So, i don't get the"not Macks players " thing. Of course their his players. He's their coach, and has been for 2 seasons. Also don't get saying we don't have talent. We have 9 four star players on this roster. And we have 7 experienced upperclassmen. And 2 solid freshman.... making us 9 deep. In a down year for college bball , We have more talent, experience, size, and depth than these teams we're losing to except UK. So we still have every right to be a factor. Let's see how it unfolds.

We are ranked and he’s doing well with what we have, but we are limited.

Mack didn’t have one player committed when he took the job. He had to go piece together Grad Transfers in 2018 in a short time.

The upperclassmen that are left basically had one year of no coaching or direction. We’re recruited by Rick to run his system for his style.

Mack has on 6 guys on the team that were his true recruits that have been brought in to play. Only 2 have really seen minutes and the other 4 are just freshman.

With the guys he inherited, he has a team that’s been ranked all year and looks to have a good seed.

We have talent, but it’s a roster that was patchwork. 6 guys were Rick’s players. We have a grad transfer brought in for depth. 6 freshman that are, well freshman that were recruited for CMM’s style.

You can’t expect a roster thrown together to just click and run smooth. It’s the type of players and fit, not the talent.

 

[zipp]

We are ranked and he’s doing well with what we have, but we are limited.

Mack didn’t have one player committed when he took the job. He had to go piece together Grad Transfers in 2018 in a short time.

The upperclassmen that are left basically had one year of no coaching or direction. We’re recruited by Rick to run his system for his style.

Mack has on 6 guys on the team that were his true recruits that have been brought in to play. Only 2 have really seen minutes and the other 4 are just freshman.

With the guys he inherited, he has a team that’s been ranked all year and looks to have a good seed.

We have talent, but it’s a roster that was patchwork. 6 guys were Rick’s players. We have a grad transfer brought in for depth. 6 freshman that are, well freshman that were recruited for CMM’s style.

You can’t expect a roster thrown together to just click and run smooth. It’s the type of players and fit, not the talent.

Two-thirds of McMahon's playing time in his U of L career has been under Mack. And that's the LOWEST percentage on the team.

Comparable stats are 73% of Perry's; 78% of Williams'; 81% of Sutton's; 84% of Nwora's; and 100% of Enoch's, Kimble's, Johnson's, and Williamson's.

The weighted team average is 82%. Over eighty percent of the combined U of L playing time for all of U of L's current players has been logged under Mack.

These guys are clearly his players, coached by him, and representative of that experience. If you're dreaming about "Mack's players" getting here and achieving much greater results, it's just that--dreaming. And IF greatness is ever achieved under Mack, that ain't the reason why...

 

[Ipartiedwithhopgood]

Yeah I'm not saying I agree or disagree with his point... but the point the guy is probably making is Mack may not have recruited ANY of these guys that Rick brought in. It doesn't matter how many minutes they've played for him they may have never been recruited by him, not because of the star range but maybe due to system mismatch.

 

[KerryRhodes]

So, i don't get the"not Macks players " thing. Of course their his players. He's their coach, and has been for 2 seasons. Also don't get saying we don't have talent. We have 9 four star players on this roster. And we have 7 experienced upperclassmen. And 2 solid freshman.... making us 9 deep. In a down year for college bball , We have more talent, experience, size, and depth than these teams we're losing to except UK. So we still have every right to be a factor. Let's see how it unfolds.

6 of the 9 players that play were the last coaches recruits. ( DJ even verballed to him)

They were recruited and signed to shoot 3s, full court press and play matchup zone. The only thing they do similar is shoot alot of 3s.

Theyre just not 100% buying in to a Coach they didnt sign for.

 

[CardsFirst]

PHCARD said:

↑



I can remember many years when another BB coach was blamed for these type of slumps. He worked them too hard, etc etc.

But to be fair, Rick had a track record of success. Before Louisville he had taken 2 schools to the Final 4 and won a title. He’d also taken an NBA team to the playoffs.

But I don’t blame Mack. I think this group is a bunch of over achievers. We overachieved so much last year that it got the hype further last year. And the overachieving is because of coaching.

We just assumed this freshman class would add to the players we had coming back and we’d roll. But we’re a bit limited on what we have.

Ryan McMahon, Dwayne Sutton, and Fresh Kimble are mid-major talents that Mack is getting a bunch out of right now. Nwora is a draft pick and is still a top scorer in the nation. Sutton was a transfer. Malik and Perry are juniors who were 4 stars, but I can’t blame Mack as the aren’t his guys and Malik plays well. Sam and DJ are freshman, not elite freshman but just good. This is a strange roster and has some limits. A lot of players who can play, but they don’t fit right now.

It’s a mixed group of Rick’s leftovers, transfers, and six freshman. We don’t have a point guard right now. This freshman group re-energized our program and we’ll see the benefits of them as the years go on.

Mack is gonna be a fine coach, I think the high expectations for this team are a result of how good of a coach he was to come in and turn it around so quick.
[/quote]
Lol remember a couple of years after Rick arrived and things went south. People were asking if he lost it and some even were advocating for him being replaced.

I won’t judge Mack until he has all his players.

My question is this. Are we playing to our competition? Ryan made a comment about how some on the team doesn’t get it, that when we play other teams we have a huge target on our back, because we were a top 5 team. And aren’t ready for the intensity the other teams bring because of that. Sure we get up for Duke and UVA, but not the Clemson and GT. Who knows.

 

[KozmasAgain]

PHCard I was going to post the same thing I remember CRP going in to a 3 game slump toward the end of the season several times. He was able to bring us our if it and have success. I don’t see how you can blame the coaches for players missing layups and dunks.

 

[Thecycle27]

At this level you better have elite athletes or have good athletes that consistently execute at a really high level.

Louisville has really good athletes that don’t execute consistently. Offensively they aren’t good enough to get where they want when they want. They have to set and use screens properly which they don’t. They have to move and cut with a purpose they don’t. When they do these things they are really good i.e Virginia. When they don’t they are a train wreck.

Defensively they aren’t long or athletic enough to really run the pack line. This is probably where the roster has impacted how he wants to play the most. They can’t keep any guard out of the lane.

Mack has a decision to make on building his roster. Moving forward that will be interesting to watch. FYI the kid from Bardstown will redshirt next year. Nowhere near ready to play at this level.

 

[Cue Card]

6 of the 9 players that play were the last coaches recruits. ( DJ even verballed to him)

They were recruited and signed to shoot 3s, full court press and play matchup zone. The only thing they do similar is shoot alot of 3s.

Theyre just not 100% buying in to a Coach they didnt sign for.

If that is true at this point then the problem is bigger than what can be fixed without a full roster turnover by purging those players who aren't 'buying in'. Each and every single one of those players had a choice once Chris Mack was hired. Stay and play for him or transfer. They chose to play for him. If they NOW have buyers remorse then this season is a bust.

 

[rockycard]

Louisville has been a pressing team for the last 50 years, letting inferior teams walk the ball up the court is asinine! It’s up to coach to show us what he’s capable of doing.

 

[Sawyer]

Louisville has been a pressing team for the last 50 years, letting inferior teams walk the ball up the court is asinine! It’s up to coach to show us what he’s capable of doing.

Not sure if this team is quick enough to press like we used to.

 

[kentuckyshame]

Worse thing about the recent slump is that we now have two bad losses, last week we didn’t have one bad loss. Bad timing to have a slump, especially one against two very mediocre teams that could have a huge impact on our tournament seed.
I like Mack, but sometimes when we struggle he seems more lost than the players, that’s scary. I’d like to think this fix could be relatively easy, start Johnson, and Ryan, and quit playing head games with Nwora.
This change could allow us to actually get ahead on teams than playing from behind by utilizing Johnson’s ability to penetrate and kick out to open sharp shooters in Ryan and Nwora, or dish to Enoch/Williams, or score himself, which he’s shown ability to do.

 

[kentuckyshame]

Louisville has been a pressing team for the last 50 years, letting inferior teams walk the ball up the court is asinine! It’s up to coach to show us what he’s capable of doing.

Man I love a good press Rocky, just not Mack’s style. The press we went to late vs Clemson was terrible, Malik looked lost half the time as did others. The press always kept us in games under Pitino, unfortunately Mack just doesn’t use it, and I I think that’s why when Mack’s teams get down double digits the game is usually over.