As usual, Crawford nails it.
- Thread starter Kratz
- Start date
Yeah, I don't think any fans are promoting issues... many just don't think this is one.
To each their own!
To each their own!
He didn't whiff on this one. This piece was published long before Jurich made his second (and completely appropriate) statement this afternoon. Jurichs statement fell right in with what Crawford had written.
Crawford nailed it, then Jurich nailed it.
Crawford nailed it, then Jurich nailed it.
Kratz you were trashing our program over on Craps Pause. What's up with that?
https://kentucky.forums.rivals.com/threads/uofl-fans-who-visit-here.219889/
https://kentucky.forums.rivals.com/threads/uofl-fans-who-visit-here.219889/
Because we were doing the wrong thing. Flat and simple. Here's copied text from that thread.
If you'll note in my original post, I said UofL has admitted that they got information from Wake. Jurich is the one that made the announcement. Sorry if you didn't connect UofL to Jurich. I said there will be silence from this point forward. I suspect it will like the Katina Powell case: The next time we hear something official is when UofL has finished it's investigation or whatever they're going to do. Didn't hear anything about Powell case for months, then UofL held a presser in which they announced violations had occurred and explained their self imposed penalties. No post season, reduced schollies, reduced recruiting, etc. and turned it over to the NCAA.
The thing that I'm most disappointed about in the Wake case is that UofL didn't inform someone. Okay, you have a disgruntled ex employee that mad he wasn't retained by the staff and now he's looking for some payback. I get that. While you're in this mode you run into an old friend (Galloway) and you give him some of that info. I get that too. Disgruntled ex employees can be a problem. However, when Galloway got this information, it should have been sent up the chain and reported to Wake that their radio guy was giving away plays. That's the part I'm bitterly disappointed in.
Hummm.......... Turns out that's exactly what Jurich wound up doing. So is Jurich trashing the program for doing what I thought should have been done from the beginning? Jurich said that's what they should have done.
UofL didn't do the right thing in the beginning, but wound up manning up, coming clean and paying an appropriate price. That's the right thing. If you call that trashing a program, you should question if you have a win at all costs view of things. I don't. I want to win the right way. Within the rules and with respect for things like rules and integrity.
So if you want to continue with that view, that's on you. When Jurich did the things I thought needed to be done (not that I had any influence) it seems to validate the stand that I took.
Hopefully this is now over, and UofL will learn and go forward doing the right thing. Winning and being an ethically sound team that we can all be proud of and don't have to defend for their actions.
.
If you'll note in my original post, I said UofL has admitted that they got information from Wake. Jurich is the one that made the announcement. Sorry if you didn't connect UofL to Jurich. I said there will be silence from this point forward. I suspect it will like the Katina Powell case: The next time we hear something official is when UofL has finished it's investigation or whatever they're going to do. Didn't hear anything about Powell case for months, then UofL held a presser in which they announced violations had occurred and explained their self imposed penalties. No post season, reduced schollies, reduced recruiting, etc. and turned it over to the NCAA.
The thing that I'm most disappointed about in the Wake case is that UofL didn't inform someone. Okay, you have a disgruntled ex employee that mad he wasn't retained by the staff and now he's looking for some payback. I get that. While you're in this mode you run into an old friend (Galloway) and you give him some of that info. I get that too. Disgruntled ex employees can be a problem. However, when Galloway got this information, it should have been sent up the chain and reported to Wake that their radio guy was giving away plays. That's the part I'm bitterly disappointed in.
Hummm.......... Turns out that's exactly what Jurich wound up doing. So is Jurich trashing the program for doing what I thought should have been done from the beginning? Jurich said that's what they should have done.
UofL didn't do the right thing in the beginning, but wound up manning up, coming clean and paying an appropriate price. That's the right thing. If you call that trashing a program, you should question if you have a win at all costs view of things. I don't. I want to win the right way. Within the rules and with respect for things like rules and integrity.
So if you want to continue with that view, that's on you. When Jurich did the things I thought needed to be done (not that I had any influence) it seems to validate the stand that I took.
Hopefully this is now over, and UofL will learn and go forward doing the right thing. Winning and being an ethically sound team that we can all be proud of and don't have to defend for their actions.
.
What do you think of it, genghis? K-rats says I think he's a slappy...
Well, kratz rhymes with rats.
Another self righteous, judge mental hypocrite looking to gain favor on a rivals board. Hard to see anything else but a rat jumping ship trying to re-board now that he approves of TJ's statement. All aboard all rats....we hardly even missed ya!
Another self righteous, judge mental hypocrite looking to gain favor on a rivals board. Hard to see anything else but a rat jumping ship trying to re-board now that he approves of TJ's statement. All aboard all rats....we hardly even missed ya!
Simple question. Do you want CBP and TJ fired?
Because if this is as big a deal as you act like, that is ALL that can "fix" it, and assure it doesn't happen again.
Clean house, and start at the top.
If you don't want them fired, then you are settling for (as Zipp said) "a bone". A suspension, fine, or what-have-you is simply fronting and saying "aw heck, we're sorry" with NOTHING CHANGING.
So say WHAT would satisfy you. And after all the bitching it can't simply be "we screwed up and it won't happen again".
BTW-Were you a Krags fan?
Nope. Wanted Krags gone because he was inept. I wanted Charlie Strong when Krags was hired. So I was 3 years ahead of the curve on that one.
Do I want TJ and BP fired? Not at this point. I wanted them to man up which is exactly what TJ did with his second statement. If staff problems continue to happen, then it might be time to look at who needs to stay or go.
I love the nothing changing argument. Admitted they did wrong, and what they should have done in the beginning. Suspended a coach. Paid a fine levied by the conference. But yeah, nothing changed.
If you think this changes nothing, then it means you believe we run a crooked program and nothings going to change. Is that what you believe? Simple question.
Do I want TJ and BP fired? Not at this point. I wanted them to man up which is exactly what TJ did with his second statement. If staff problems continue to happen, then it might be time to look at who needs to stay or go.
I love the nothing changing argument. Admitted they did wrong, and what they should have done in the beginning. Suspended a coach. Paid a fine levied by the conference. But yeah, nothing changed.
If you think this changes nothing, then it means you believe we run a crooked program and nothings going to change. Is that what you believe? Simple question.
I don't think it's crooked. We're not winning big enough, especially in BB, to be crooked.
But with all the "scandals" we've had, all the main players are still there. TJ, CRP, CBP.
So, yes, I maintain nothing has changed. The difference is, I'm not bitching about it.
You are ok with "Nothing happened. Quit messing with our bowl prep. No, wait we're sorry and the scoundrel is suspended a game", while I'd been ok with just sticking to the original story.
Neither makes a bit of difference.
I guess we can just agree to disagree on certain issues. I say how I feel, you say how you feel. Feelings are just another form of opinion.
Integrity has always mattered to me. It's part of my personality. Our integrity has taken some hits, that's undeniable. Agreed?
Full disclosure: I've never liked Pitino and I've let it be known on many occasions. However, I don't consider Sypher to be a "scandal" on him. Wow.... A rich famous guy sleeps with another woman. Never heard of that happening before, plus it happened in 2003. Sypher made it a scandal when she tried to blackmail him. She's in jail. She was the scandal on that one, just so happened to involve our coach who was preaching one lifestyle while living another. He owes everyone he ever kicked off the team for "breaking team rules" an apology.
Back to topic, I was beginning to wander there. With Sypher, then Pitino and the Dorms and now Wakeyleaks, our staff is looking bad. Nothing like Baylor, Penn State, etc but heading down that same path. Petrino is always going to be a lightning rod. There's no wiggle room there. Pitino is just about in the same boat. I don't think he would survive another scandal. He would "retire" the same way Denny did.
You talk about wining "big". I submit that we're better than Oklahoma as a sports program and look at the mess they're in right now. We're also better as a program than Baylor. Better all around program than Penn St. Better all around program than Tennessee or Miami as well. There's your true black hats of college athletics right now. Do they win bigger than us?
Miami and Penn State are in the process of pulling themselves out of the gutter, but they will carry that rep for a long time. It's going to take us awhile to pull ourselves out too, even though we never got in as deep as them.
Like I said in another post, the hardest thing to build and the easiest thing to destroy is your reputation. Football had 3 squeaky clean years under Petrino, but this one incident put him back in the Arkansas light. We knew the risks bringing him back on, and in doing so we have to do it better than everyone else to be viewed in a good light. Yeah, it's an uneven playing field, but we made the field uneven by hiring him. I was in favor of hiring him, and still want him to be here, but it comes with a price. You can't mess up because of his record. The man is a lightning rod and you have to work with that if you want him. We failed in this case. Petrino is probably completely innocent on this one. But bad decisions by other coaches and a bad press release by Jurich put us in this spot.
Jurich quickly made amends on his bad press release with a damn near perfect one a couple of days later. But those few days are going to stick with us for awhile.
And to top it off we're still waiting to hear from the NCAA on the Dorm scandal.
You can't keep doing this stupid stuff when you're already under the microscope.
Integrity has always mattered to me. It's part of my personality. Our integrity has taken some hits, that's undeniable. Agreed?
Full disclosure: I've never liked Pitino and I've let it be known on many occasions. However, I don't consider Sypher to be a "scandal" on him. Wow.... A rich famous guy sleeps with another woman. Never heard of that happening before, plus it happened in 2003. Sypher made it a scandal when she tried to blackmail him. She's in jail. She was the scandal on that one, just so happened to involve our coach who was preaching one lifestyle while living another. He owes everyone he ever kicked off the team for "breaking team rules" an apology.
Back to topic, I was beginning to wander there. With Sypher, then Pitino and the Dorms and now Wakeyleaks, our staff is looking bad. Nothing like Baylor, Penn State, etc but heading down that same path. Petrino is always going to be a lightning rod. There's no wiggle room there. Pitino is just about in the same boat. I don't think he would survive another scandal. He would "retire" the same way Denny did.
You talk about wining "big". I submit that we're better than Oklahoma as a sports program and look at the mess they're in right now. We're also better as a program than Baylor. Better all around program than Penn St. Better all around program than Tennessee or Miami as well. There's your true black hats of college athletics right now. Do they win bigger than us?
Miami and Penn State are in the process of pulling themselves out of the gutter, but they will carry that rep for a long time. It's going to take us awhile to pull ourselves out too, even though we never got in as deep as them.
Like I said in another post, the hardest thing to build and the easiest thing to destroy is your reputation. Football had 3 squeaky clean years under Petrino, but this one incident put him back in the Arkansas light. We knew the risks bringing him back on, and in doing so we have to do it better than everyone else to be viewed in a good light. Yeah, it's an uneven playing field, but we made the field uneven by hiring him. I was in favor of hiring him, and still want him to be here, but it comes with a price. You can't mess up because of his record. The man is a lightning rod and you have to work with that if you want him. We failed in this case. Petrino is probably completely innocent on this one. But bad decisions by other coaches and a bad press release by Jurich put us in this spot.
Jurich quickly made amends on his bad press release with a damn near perfect one a couple of days later. But those few days are going to stick with us for awhile.
And to top it off we're still waiting to hear from the NCAA on the Dorm scandal.
You can't keep doing this stupid stuff when you're already under the microscope.
It must be hard for you to be so humble. Portraying yourself as the expert you are on all things UofL must be a heavy burden. Me, I don't judge the program on what I want it to be, I merely enjoy it for what it is.
Carry on Benedict, many of us prefer to remain anonymous and behind the scenes in our faith and don't run to the cats site to air dirty laundry. That is what affirms your credibility existence or not on this site now. And that is on you and not TJ, CRP or Galloway. Lie down with the cats and you get fleas from them too.
This is a pretty good point. And if/when it becomes "too much" then it's probably best to take a step back/away, etc.
As stated a gazillion times, the "sport" is big business with entirely too much $ involved to apply regular societal norms. Fans have to understand this, and pick their moral/ethical battles.
Compare "shared plays" to OU's leading rusher.
I can respect your POV. But putting it on the cats rival site is not the 'right way' to do it.
I am from a military background. If you ever get the chance.....study up on Patton, Eisenhower and MacArthur. They were not exactly choir boys but they knew how to defeat the enemy and win the grandest World War in this planets existence to date.
No one is perfect or ever 100% just and righteous. That is the reality of the situation and thank God this country had men who were not afraid to do what had to be done to win the war and public opinion be damned.
It is not up to me or really anyone to second guess the decisions they made under the responsibility they bore to do their job. What is that old saying,? "God grant me the serenity to accept the things 'I' cannot change......The courage to change the things 'I' can......And the wisdom to know the difference."
Confiding with the "enemy' by airing dirty laundry is not very wise.....not a good way to behave as a Cardinal fan IMO..
I'm a military man also. I don't consider UK to be the enemy. They're a rival, and some of them are obnoxious. But there's also some good ones on that site, just like this site. I enjoy talking to the reasonable ones.
Part of the reason I do it is to get a different perception. Too many UofL fans take things blindly. I don't like that approach. I want to hear all sides. Some of them raise some good points.
When I see something I feel to be wrong, I say so. That's part of my military background. We did wrong. Galloway shouldn't have taken the info. When discovered, Wake should have been quietly contacted and told they had a mole. Then Jurich had a bad statement, very bad. He followed it up a few days later with a very good statement and did the right things.
It was a golden opportunity for us to clean up our image some, and it became a blown opportunity that snowballed into something worse.
How do think we would be perceived if we had gone straight to Wake with the info as soon as it happened? Pundits and talking heads from coast to coast would be talking about how Louisville did the right thing. Instead, we dug our hole a little deeper.
With you being military, I'm sure you can appreciate being known for doing things the right way. We had that chance and didn't use it.
Part of the reason I do it is to get a different perception. Too many UofL fans take things blindly. I don't like that approach. I want to hear all sides. Some of them raise some good points.
When I see something I feel to be wrong, I say so. That's part of my military background. We did wrong. Galloway shouldn't have taken the info. When discovered, Wake should have been quietly contacted and told they had a mole. Then Jurich had a bad statement, very bad. He followed it up a few days later with a very good statement and did the right things.
It was a golden opportunity for us to clean up our image some, and it became a blown opportunity that snowballed into something worse.
How do think we would be perceived if we had gone straight to Wake with the info as soon as it happened? Pundits and talking heads from coast to coast would be talking about how Louisville did the right thing. Instead, we dug our hole a little deeper.
With you being military, I'm sure you can appreciate being known for doing things the right way. We had that chance and didn't use it.
Stealing plays IS part of the game. If they can get the advantage by reading a coaches lips on the sidelines..they'll do it. That's why all the coaches cover their mouths. It's why coaches have closed practices. It's why multiple guys signal in plays. So it's really no surprise TJ took it lightly. He might even have a budget line that is dedicated to keeping our plays from being stolen...Unlike WF.
You write well Kratz. But sure seem naive.
You write well Kratz. But sure seem naive.
Not naive, just too hopeful I guess. With the microscope Petrino is and will continue to be under, I was hoping that UofL would be extra careful with football.
Yes, football is a very secretive sport, and they're always trying to gain an edge. But to use an old phrase there should still be honor among thieves. There are lines, and UofL crossed one with a coach and athletic department that's already under a lot of scrutiny.
Hell, the whole school is under scrutiny right now. No President, 2 different BOT's waiting for the courts to settle that one, audit of the other organization (name slips my mind at the moment) doesn't look good. Academic probation on the whole school right now. The list goes on.........
Yes, football is a very secretive sport, and they're always trying to gain an edge. But to use an old phrase there should still be honor among thieves. There are lines, and UofL crossed one with a coach and athletic department that's already under a lot of scrutiny.
Hell, the whole school is under scrutiny right now. No President, 2 different BOT's waiting for the courts to settle that one, audit of the other organization (name slips my mind at the moment) doesn't look good. Academic probation on the whole school right now. The list goes on.........
But you're talking about a commonly accepted practice. To the point where coaches have taken extreme precautions. These precautions are now mainstream.
To accept plays from someone on the other side isn't a common practice. That's crossing the line.
Someone said I'm a traitor because I post on the UK board. I don't say anything there that I wouldn't say here. I don't think that makes me a traitor. I've got no secrets. Accepting secret plays from a true traitor is getting in bed with that traitor. Makes you no better than them.
Someone said I'm a traitor because I post on the UK board. I don't say anything there that I wouldn't say here. I don't think that makes me a traitor. I've got no secrets. Accepting secret plays from a true traitor is getting in bed with that traitor. Makes you no better than them.
Totally agree on the integrity issue.
Agree that CBP needs to do it better and cleaner than others.
But die is cast and his past is never going away. If he's a saint for ten years and something happens, it's all free game again.
Nothing me and you can do.
Forget it Ipartied. We done slayed the dragon here with logic and reasoning. --Stealing plays is stealing plays. A person with integrity would have done recognized it.
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