you guys have some real good ones and you seem to be very glad to have them on board. that being said I have to wonder if that has changed any of your minds about 1 year players. I am asking this for conversation and to get your thoughts and if you think Rick may start recruiting more 1 and done players. peace.
5th year seniors
- Thread starter moe#8
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Pitino has been recruiting one and dones all along. There's nothing to change his mind about.
These are done and 1 players. College isn't just a babysitting program for them.
Absolutely no difference when it comes to your fanbases incessant use of L1C4!!! These guys are as much committed to your school and program as freshman. Get over it.
There went "peace." Right out da window.
BTW, the "4" in L1C4 doesn't stand for four years. It's "Louisville forever." And if you don't think Trey Lewis and Damion Lee won't leave next spring feeling fully embraced by and thoroughly dedicated to the Louisville fan base, then I don't know what to tell you.
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Actually it's a large difference between a 1 year college player who turns pro, oppose to a 5th year graduate player. Mainly one has obtainted a degree and working toward another degree, and the other hasn't.
As for changing Pitino's mind, I say his thoughts are the same now as they were before.
As for changing Pitino's mind, I say his thoughts are the same now as they were before.
Not as far as their commitment to your program there isn't. Both are there 1 year - that's the limit of their commitment. No difference whatsoever.
I fail to understand your point and what it is your trying to get us to admit too? I gave you the difference between graduate players and freshman.
If true, it is very strange how your refer to UofL.
In any case, it would be a very rare case where an 18 year old would have the same level of appreciation and respect for the opportunity as a 23 year old.
I can see your argument, however IMO, I see no difference in having one and dones vs done and ones when it pertains to the development and growth they'll get in that one year. One could argue that a younger, less experienced, player will get much more from that one year in college vs a fifth year player. I don't think its a bad move for UofL, especially seeing how it's paying off this year.
Also, the idea that these players are L1C4, as I understand the concept, is silly, and to beat your chest that all of your players are that type of player goes out the window when getting fifth year transfers.
A big difference between OAD and DAO kids... Kids in the first group take in a year of college because they HAVE to; the second group because they WANT to. It's why L&L value being here.
"Elite program", my a$$...
"Elite program", my a$$...
100% correct Zipp. The 5th years players attend because they want to be at the University. The 1 and done attend because they are force to by the NBA.
And, OADs choose the University they want to attend for that one year. They aren't forced to attend any one school, and if they so choose, they can bypass college altogether, ala Emmanuel Mudiay. No difference.
The next MJ from the Congo! Who wast taken 7th in the draft. Who still needs to learn how to shoot, pass and walk? LOL. He couldn't beat out Snider for PT here.
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And OAD kids see that as how they spend a year in purgatory. Who can make that year as easy and painless as possible. Which players-first program can showcase them the best or most.
DAO kids want to go where they can improve. Otherwise, why delay a year? See the word "improve" anywhere in the first situation?
Find me a quote where Pitino or the L&L guys have talked about getting them into the NBA. To the contrary, both guys have said they're here in large part because they've never had a chance to play in the NCAA tourney. No players-first in there.
"Elite program", my a$$...
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Helen Keller could tell there is some kind of agenda here with clock. Just come out and say what you want to say....
I don't know what Rick is thinking...my thoughts, 5th year guy's are familiar with the college game and appreciate the subtleties required to excel as a college team...this appreciation is a result of time played at the college level...Typical OAD players barely get a foot in the door and don't have the patience or desire to acquire such things...Very big difference, and if you don't see it; you are blinded by bias that can't be reasoned with.
And to better state the reality, it's not that Rick doesn't want them...it's they don't want Rick, because he values the importance of these subtleties and that requires effort and time on the part of the player. Keep in mind, I'm not judging the players here at all, they have their values and I understand that...Cal understands that too, and he coaches to his players values (or maybe they just share common values).
And to better state the reality, it's not that Rick doesn't want them...it's they don't want Rick, because he values the importance of these subtleties and that requires effort and time on the part of the player. Keep in mind, I'm not judging the players here at all, they have their values and I understand that...Cal understands that too, and he coaches to his players values (or maybe they just share common values).
I'm not sure why people seem to bash one-and-done players. If a player is ready after one year, let them go. If a player only has one year in them, welcome them in. Yes, graduate transfers are more mature (older and more experienced) and most likely more ready to play... but they are still one-and-done... and that is not a bad thing. Take a kid that is highly talented and a sure fire lottery pick... he is no less dedicated than the graduate transfer... he probably works just has hard, has the desire to excel... but he won't stick around... and that is not a bad thing either. Talent and work ethic are not mutually exclusive.
Rick has made his thoughts clear on this. Lee is a one-and-done player AND a good fit for the Cards.
"On how grad transfers can help U of L: Well, first of all, they've got to be a great person. I'm very much for the one and done in this regard. I love one and dones at the fifth-year level because you get mature individuals who have leadership qualities who really, really want to be part -- maybe they weren't a part of the NCAA tournament and the national stage, and this is their opportunity and they're hungry for it. I love one and done players. This will be my first one and done." (LINK)
Even Rick calls them one-and-done... so can we stop with the "done-and-one" nonsense. That is just as bad as 'succeed-and-proceed"
Rick has made his thoughts clear on this. Lee is a one-and-done player AND a good fit for the Cards.
"On how grad transfers can help U of L: Well, first of all, they've got to be a great person. I'm very much for the one and done in this regard. I love one and dones at the fifth-year level because you get mature individuals who have leadership qualities who really, really want to be part -- maybe they weren't a part of the NCAA tournament and the national stage, and this is their opportunity and they're hungry for it. I love one and done players. This will be my first one and done." (LINK)
Even Rick calls them one-and-done... so can we stop with the "done-and-one" nonsense. That is just as bad as 'succeed-and-proceed"
This is precisely what I was getting at, without spelling it all out. So, the "so and so is L1C4 and so and so isn't" should just stop now. I get the concept, but not every player playing at UofL is there for the program now and forever, just like not every one and done that commits to UK or Duke is some sort of mercenary that cares only for their individual desires. Its silly and just needs to be retired.I'm not sure why people seem to bash one-and-done players. If a player is ready after one year, let them go. If a player only has one year in them, welcome them in. Yes, graduate transfers are more mature (older and more experienced) and most likely more ready to play... but they are still one-and-done... and that is not a bad thing. Take a kid that is highly talented and a sure fire lottery pick... he is no less dedicated than the graduate transfer... he probably works just has hard, has the desire to excel... but he won't stick around... and that is not a bad thing either. Talent and work ethic are not mutually exclusive.
Rick has made his thoughts clear on this. Lee is a one-and-done player AND a good fit for the Cards.
"On how grad transfers can help U of L: Well, first of all, they've got to be a great person. I'm very much for the one and done in this regard. I love one and dones at the fifth-year level because you get mature individuals who have leadership qualities who really, really want to be part -- maybe they weren't a part of the NCAA tournament and the national stage, and this is their opportunity and they're hungry for it. I love one and done players. This will be my first one and done." (LINK)
Even Rick calls them one-and-done... so can we stop with the "done-and-one" nonsense. That is just as bad as 'succeed-and-proceed"
Using your logic, then basically every team slogan at every level of sports should be retired. Awesome straw man argument.
Nah,we like it too much.Besides,it's getting under your skin as well.
No, not it at all. I don't care if you use the term, "L1C4", if you want to; even though it sounds ridiculous. I just think its really silly when used to describe ones allegiance to your school/program. As in, "he/she is L1C4". And, IMO, "L1C4" is not a "team slogan", it's a fanbase slogan. It's nothing like other real team slogans like "Roll Tide" or "WAR Eagle", in that you don't ever hear anyone saying "L1C4". Its used mostly in print, which would make it even easier to just forget.
Actually I wouldn't say the kids in the second group necessarily WANT to. If they had a choice I'm sure they would go pro and make money playing the game they love. I believe they too HAVE to take in another year of college if they wish to continue to play basketball competitively.
You must not have watched Lewis or Lee if you dob't think they could be playing pro ball right now
Come on man... No way you seriously believe they chose UofL over pro ball. You almost got me!
You saying neither guy could have played in the D League or overseas? Lee is better than both Harrison
Oh yes, #L1C4 is so silly...just like #BBN or #SeeBlue. I see where you are coming from.
So, you think Lee just figured out how to play basketball? Maybe he just wanted to play basketball BETTER.
"Elite program", my a$$...
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Lee averaged 21 PPG last year, so it was no secret the guy knew how to play. I think the question was/is how effective he would be in a power 5 conference. I think he cam to UofL to get a chance to play in the NCAA tournament. The point I was trying to make to the above poster is that choose to come to UofL as you said to improve. It's not like he couldn't have been playing pro ball somewhere.
Those aren't sports slogans either, those are fanbase slogans. BBN makes sense in that sense, SeeBlue is ignorant.
100% agree, and my bad. I intended to respond to the slapd!ck and not you.
"Elite program", my a$$...
L1C4 is a perspective...the words and slogan are inconsequential.
Most kids come to U of L to learn how to play basketball better, to improve themselves. I would say that's definitely true about "5th year seniors".
A handful of 5-star kids may have that same perspective about LPT. Typically, they just wanna spend a few months in college because they have to. They don't really wanna work that hard, esp. on defense, and they know (or think) they'll get guaranteed playing time. And for some reason, they believe that Pitino Lite can showcase them even though the majority of their games are against $hit basketball teams that no one else cares about.
I'd prefer to watch the first group of kids play basketball and against good teams.
"Elite program", my a$$...
Most kids come to U of L to learn how to play basketball better, to improve themselves. I would say that's definitely true about "5th year seniors".
A handful of 5-star kids may have that same perspective about LPT. Typically, they just wanna spend a few months in college because they have to. They don't really wanna work that hard, esp. on defense, and they know (or think) they'll get guaranteed playing time. And for some reason, they believe that Pitino Lite can showcase them even though the majority of their games are against $hit basketball teams that no one else cares about.
I'd prefer to watch the first group of kids play basketball and against good teams.
"Elite program", my a$$...
I don't know the answer to this but to think that they could, and still choose to play in college, just isn't realistic. The only way I see this as even being remotely possible is if Pitino sold them on having a better chance at the NBA vs playing abroad, but that's a sell worthy of Zig Ziglar's admiration. Besides, it's probably a mute point as it may not be long before the 5th year transfer is no longer available...
Mid Major coaches don't like the rule and want it changed, per this article...
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I just don't see the evidence of this. If they could play at the next level, they would. It's as I stated in another post, they may have been sold on the idea that playing another year might give them a chance at the NBA vs abroad, but they didn't go to UofL to just be better.
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