Yes, This year is Rick's fault

[slippery1]

Rick makes upwards of 5 million a year

In any other business or industry he would be expected to produce a quality product every year

He has been very fortunate to have "found" Russ Smith, Luke Hancock, and Montrez Harrell.

The game and recruiting is changing but just like Denny, in his last few years, Rick has blinders on

This is a fast paced society. 2 years is an eternity. Things change at the speed of light. It is not 2013.

You must have shooters--We don't

Defense is no longer the most important criteria when judging a recruit. They don't want to play defense. You must surprise them with that requirement after they get here, not shout it from the rooftops during their recruitment. It must be simplified so freshmen can concentrate on offense and play from the get go.

In order to recruit the 5 star freshmen you must play them and let them learn during pre conference games.

You must quit forcing square pegs into round holes. You must adjust to the abilities or lack of same of your players.

You should demand we go with Nike. (should not have signed this last contract)

In short if most of the above was being addressed and we were still in the shape we are in I would not be so uneasy. because I could see light at the end of the tunnel. It is Rick's refusal to modify his way of doing things in the face of poor results that is so upsetting.

Now bash away -- just my opinion.--everybody has one. The above does not mean that I want Rick gone or that I don't appreciate what he has done for the program.

And yes all great coaches have down years i.e.: Williams, Coach K, Izzo, ect

 

[zipp]

Your standard for "quality" can be debated. In the first year of the ACC, I'm good with what we are accomplishing not just in basketball but across all sports. We all have our opinions, but my opinion is that your standard may be out of adjustment.

I'm not a big believer in luck, at least not for a sustained period. That we were simply lucky to find various players in various places is hard to swallow. I recall LPT fans claiming how lucky we were to have Brian Brohm and Michael Bush in our backyard. If you haven't read lately, it's not a good thing for me to be comparing you to LPT fans.

"Rick has blinders on" is just venting on your part. When Denny retired, it had been 15 years since he won a championship. Pitino won his last one less than TWO years ago.

The pace of things has relevance, but it's not that you must fundamentally change. It's that you must ADAPT. Pitino talks about that stuff constantly, and I'm satisfied that he's aware of the situation. Does that mean he can adapt seamlessly?...no.

We have shooters when we pass well and try to run an offense. Amazing how that stuff goes hand in hand.

This may be a news flash, but Pitino doesn't really want 5-star freshmen. And I think he probably has a pretty good gauge on how to get them to play defense. It's NOT by relaxing your requirement that they eventually learn how to play defense, and be able to do it.

"Square pegs and round holes" is more venting.

I'm not interested in Nike because I'm not interested in the Nike player and his mindset. It's generally not L1C4. We're an adidas school because they pay the most money and SAY they will give us great unis. We hear that's important too!

I think some of you guys are in denial. Have you heard about "L1C4", and do you embrace what it means? That's the bedrock on which your program is being built. If you have an issue with that, you have an issue with Pitino himself--not all of these tactical things. In fact, I'd argue you have an issue with no less than Jurich, because he's using that very L1C4 label to characterize his entire athletic department. Posts like OP show that some of us are lost in the details...

This post was edited on 3/5 4:41 PM by zipp

 

[AzCard]

Rick is responsible for EVERY year, great, good, bad, disastrous, or indifferent. I think this year is good to indifferent.

 

[Cue Card]

Originally posted by AzCard:
Rick is responsible for EVERY year, great, good, bad, disastrous, or indifferent. I think this year is good to indifferent.

So far.

The year isn't over just yet. We still have 2 to 3 weeks left. Maybe longer.

 

[NoseBleedSection]

I really don't think this is all Rick's fault. Rick should share in the blame but I also think it has to do with a little bit of bad luck as well. This team would be much much better if Behanan hadn't started smoking dope and if Ware hadn't broke his leg. It also didn't help that CJ decided to go off and get into legal trouble. If not for all these problems our lineup this year would be: Jones, Ware, Blackshear, Behanan and Harrell with Rozier coming off the bench.

 

[CACard]

To the OP, "in the face of poor results" was the straw that broker the camel's back on how absurd your post got. In the last four year, four years, with two of those in the Big East and one in the ACC, we have just very recently dropped from first in the country with the most wins alllll the way down to second in the country with the most wins. We have been ranked throughout this season with only two losses to teams not ranked in the top 20. Ridiculous expectations from anyone!

To NoseBleed, you had me until you just said Ware would be starting and Rozier would be coming off the bench....please, please tell me where you get your drugs, because I need to stock up on that shit!!!

 

[CardFanDad]

I agree with the OP's basic point: this year's relatively disappointing results (so far) are significantly Rick's fault. Here are my arguments:

1) The team has not made meaningful progress over the course of the year. In fact, after watching last night, we might have gone backwards. Defense has gotten worse. Offense was never good and has not improved. Some of this, but not all, is due to losing Jones. But the coach's job is to improve the team over the course of the season. This team has not improved.

2) Out talent is superior to our results. This team has 2 great players, Rozier and Harrell, and a third very good player, Wayne. Few teams we play have even one player as good as either our best 2. Take ND for example: one great player, Grant, and a bunch of solid role players. With the talent we have, we ought to be able to compete with anyone except UK. And yet we continue to struggle, especially at the offensive end.

3) The Freshmen are underperforming. Aaron, Johnson, Onuaku, and Snider were all highly rated recruits. Except for Snider, and to a lesser extent Nanu, they have contributed basically 0. And even now, at the end of the year, when, as the cliche goes, "they aren't freshmen anymore," Aaron and Jones are complete 0s. Other teams integrate freshmen successfully into their systems--we have not. The coach's job is to bring along the younger players. Rick has not accomplished that this year.

4) The Centers are abysmal. Nanu is merely disappointing. When I saw him in the first games, I thought he might be a Freshman of the Year candidate. Remember his early-season double-doubles? (Yes, I know the competition was weak.) But he's faded as time has gone on. Mathiang, on the other hand, is horrific. He's been in the program 3 years now and last night's performance shows what he can give: 4 minutes, no points, no assists, no blocks, 5 fouls. Again, the coach's job is to develop the talent. Nanu and Mango have not developed.

5) Anton Gill. End of his second year and, like the others, little progress.

6) Finally, our offense is horrific. I think I might scream the next time I see the start of our "offense:" Q to Trezl to Wayne, dribble, dribble, to Terry, all taking place 35 feet from the basket. Did you see how efficiently ND converted last night? How they spread the floor and found the open man? That's scheme and coaching, folks, and for some reason we don't have it.

I get that some of this is up to the players. But I've mentioned 5 players, all of whom we thought in October would make a meaningful contribution, and none of them have. When you have that level of failure/disappointment, the blame isn't on all of the players--it is on the coach.

What most concerns me is that the cupboard is going to be really bare next year, with Wayne, Rozier, and Trezl leaving. What if Aaron, Johnson, and Gill decide to transfer? I'm encouraged by Q and by Anas, but past that I see very little to be excited about on the existing team. We've got some talent coming in, but who is to say that they will be able to produce as freshmen?

So is this season Rick's fault? I have to say that he gets most of the blame.

 

[jmac1029]

Win or lose it's all on him. He recruits the players.

 

[slippery1]

You are right Zipp. Adapt is a better word. I think a case can be made that this season equals 'poor results" but only when measured against our recent standards. Maybe you guys are right that I am asking too much to be top 10 every year. However, if you will go back and read what I said more closely I try to make it clear that my main concern is that next year if Rick does not change his way of dealing with freshmen we will have a very lackluster season. This also applies to our ability to recruit impact freshmen. We have already lost one because of the nike issue.

 

[Big_Tasty_Muffin]

Would you rather be Florida (15-15)?? or Michigan (14-15)?? UCONN (17-11)???

We've stayed in the top 10 roughly 75% of the year, our ONLY bad loss is to NC State who could make the tournament. It's not a great year but its not a disaster either. It could be a lot worse. I want us to be in the final 4 every year just like everyone else but realistically your going to have an off year every once in a while. If this is our off year, then it is not bad IMO.

 

[zipp]

It's funny stuff, and everyone is vulnerable.

True story... I was on the phone with my 80-year old mother last nite who was whining that she's "tired of losing". I asked what she was talking about. Not recalling the exact number, I said you've lost 6 or 7 games and won 20-something. "You're spoiled", I said. Of course, she laughed and halfway agreed.

It's sort of nice to be spoiled--you're used to success--but you have to remain aware that you ARE spoiled. It's your perspective, not reality. In reality, you could be Michigan or Florida, as Muffin just pointed out. Then, how happy would you be?

BTW, for anyone who dares say that I'm coping or relaxing my standards, I said the same thing in our last title run a couple years ago. You enjoy it, but you don't lose perspective...

 

[LouisvilleKid79]

The last two post nailed it.

 

[lawsonhawk]

Asinine. Times like these are when fans need to take some time off.

Who did UofL beat just two years ago for the effin National Championship? Hmm . . . Michigan? Where are they now? No team does it every year. NONE.

Syracuse? Georgetown? . . . Name the team.

Last years national champion . . . hoping to make the tourney this year.

I'm watching VCU get clocked by Davidson. Shaka Smart must be an idiot.

Here's the big one . . . Maybe, just maybe, this team is . . . wait for it . . . OUTPERFORMING.it's talent. This team has a scoring guard and a power forward that can't handle the ball or shoot for crap face-up. That's it.

I guess no other team wanted Louisville recruits because they suck. Rick got stupid just this year. Amazing transformation.

 

[lonedingo93]

I thought Rick got paid more than 5 million a year?

 

[ACCCard]

This is proably one of the most ridiculous things I have read all year. Final judgment has already been made by the hyper critics. Who cares how much money CRP makes? If we paid him less, would you be satisfied with the results? So he got lucky with the recruits that worked out and he had blinders on with all the rest? So the recruits don't want to play defense, so the coach should let them? Defense is just as important as offense. It is 50% of the game. We lost last night on poor defense. One of their bettr shooting games. No bash way? Are you serious? The little disclaimer at the end didn't fool anybody. The season has been a little below expectation and coaches and players all share the responsibility. It is rarely the fault of just the coach or just the players. Anyone who states otherwise, lacks credibility as far as basketball goes.

 

[samstewartsam1]

Originally posted by zipp:

True story... I was on the phone with my 80-year old mother last nite...

Seriously? Are you that lazy that you can't just go upstairs from the basement and talk to her?

 

[Morgantown Card]

This season isn't done yet; let it play out.

This is a Sweet 16 team talentwise & experience-wise. An Elite 8 would be a tremendous success.

 

[lonedingo93]

Originally posted by samstewartsam1:

Originally posted by zipp:

True story... I was on the phone with my 80-year old mother last nite...

Seriously? Are you that lazy that you can't just go upstairs from the basement and talk to her?

She should teach him how to spell night and tonight.

Kidding zipper. But seriously.., Tonite is just the more phonetically spelled, informal and wrong form of tonight.

 

[J-Rye_UL]

This thread is ridiculous. No idea why I stopped by to read it. Just not much out there these days.

 

[lawsonhawk]

Originally posted by ACCCard:
This is proably one of the most ridiculous things I have read all year. Final judgment has already been made by the hyper critics. Who cares how much money CRP makes? If we paid him less, would you be satisfied with the results?[/B] So he got lucky with the recruits that worked out and he had blinders on with all the rest? So the recruits don't want to play defense, so the coach should let them? Defense is just as important as offense. It is 50% of the game. We lost last night on poor defense. One of their bettr shooting games. No bash way? Are you serious? The little disclaimer at the end didn't fool anybody. The season has been a little below expectation and coaches and players all share the responsibility. It is rarely the fault of just the coach or just the players. Anyone who states otherwise, lacks credibility as far as basketball goes.



That's kind of funny.

 

[zipp]

Originally posted by samstewartsam1:

Originally posted by zipp:

True story... I was on the phone with my 80-year old mother last nite...

Seriously? Are you that lazy that you can't just go upstairs from the basement and talk to her?I've always been grateful mine had her full set of chromosomes.

"Elite program", my a$$...

 

[KRJ1975]

Yeah J-Rye, its gotten pretty bad. Very few avenues anymore to express actual opinions - its all personal attacks and rehashing stuff that happened a lifetime ago.

Still not as bad as the scout board though.

 

[Briggsky]

Rick has brought in ten million more dollars than any other program in each of the last three years. I think being the third or fourth highest paid coach in the country is fair. One other fact is that in that same three years he's won more games than anyone. Not worth the money???

 

[REDBEASTFURRY]

Rick is a stubborn old man now. That doesn't except change well . Although today he finally showed a willingness to accept his way doesn't always work.Hopefully he will see that he needs shooters and players that can play from the start and lrength.

 

[CiscotheKING]

Quick question Slippery and I'm serious.
Sounds like you have all the answers. Do you think you would do a better job than CRP?

 

[zipp]

Originally posted by REDBEASTFURRY:
Rick is a stubborn old man now. That doesn't except (sic) change well . Although today he finally showed a willingness to accept his way doesn't always work.Hopefully he will see that he needs shooters and players that can play from the start and lrength.Pitino has shown a willingness to adapt, but he's not changing fundamentally. And I'm glad for that. He's always going to preach defense, team play, and filling the stat line.

The message today isn't about any fundamental change. He's compensating for the loss of Jones and the need to play so many inexperienced/freshmen players. If he had the roster he wanted or expected to have, we wouldn't be hearing about any changes. And if he does anything noticeable, I don't expect it to last more than a few weeks...

 

[Mayoman]

Originally posted by REDBEASTFURRY:
Rick is a stubborn old man now. That doesn't except change well . Although today he finally showed a willingness to accept his way doesn't always work.Hopefully he will see that he needs shooters and players that can play from the start and lrength.

That is still better than an insolent, young man who knows not of what he speaks.

Age is a matter of perspective....to a 70 or 80 year old man.....CRP is still a young pup.

Your post reeks of envy and disrespect.

What exactly are players that can play from the start and lrenght? Please inform us mere mortals what that means?

 

[Ipartiedwithhopgood]

24-7. 4th place finish in ACC, pre-season projected to be 3rd. Loses 3rd leading scorer and two weeks later his team gives UVA their 2nd loss of the year.

Rick's fault!

 

[cuzimacardfan]

Originally posted by Ipartiedwithhopgood:
24-7. 4th place finish in ACC, pre-season projected to be 3rd. Loses 3rd leading scorer and two weeks later his team gives UVA their 2nd loss of the year.

Rick's fault!

I think he's done a heck of a coaching job this year.

 

[Ipartiedwithhopgood]

Rick makes upwards of 5 million a year



Now bash away -- just my opinion.--everybody has one. Izzo, ect

We made the E8. We're on a great run.

Your OP is horrendous.

 

[Ipartiedwithhopgood]

This season isn't done yet; let it play out.

This is a Sweet 16 team talentwise & experience-wise. An Elite 8 would be a tremendous success.

This guy gets it.

 

[Senore2006]

This guy gets it.

Ha ha, you have to love when someone falls this flat on their face with their self-possessed basketball "acumen". One free throw away from the Final Four is a result many of us would have taken at the start of the season, probably including the OP.

The hallmark of Louisville under Pitino - and no one else nationally is even close - is in how hard we work. It constantly amazes broadcasters. This feature of our basketball program has become a unique and noteworthy brand in the college game. The implications are numerous and mostly good (aside from injury prospects) - what it means is a pathetically bad shooting team can achieve fairly amazing heights on the basis or work and defense alone. The fundamentals of all this are the early season achievements, quiet as they may be, of Cardinal hoops and it forms an immovable layer of competence which a "good-shooting team" can take all the way.

Pitino's system is unique and incredibly satisfying to watch, even if this past season had us all sitting in dentist's chairs undergoing root canal therapy during games. The man has addressed the poor shooting woes which Ware and Gill were supposed to provide, not the overworked Terry. The players coming in - including the immediate impact of the 5th year guys - should offer a much more productive version on offense and lead to the next years' of yet more high final results, if not another Championship.

Whatever Rick's doing, in any case, I want to see more of it, not less.

 

[OneEarWonder]

The hallmark of Louisville under Pitino - and no one else nationally is even close - is in how hard we work. It constantly amazes broadcasters. This feature of our basketball program has become a unique and noteworthy brand in the college game

What amazes me is Pitino has always done that... and broadcasters are still surprised. Do they even watch basketball? Boston U, Providence, UK, UL... did not translate as well with the Celtics. Hard work and total effort on every play, especially defense, plus killer practices/conditioning has always been a staple of RP's teams! He is truly one of the greatest coaches of his generation. I'm not sure enough people appreciate how special he is, how much influence on the game he has had, and how lucky we are as a Commonwealth to have had him lead BOTH marquee programs.

He had what, 3 FF and 1 NC at each school plus FF at Providence. Unparalleled success, almost 40 years and still going strong... so if it's Rick Fault, I'll take my chances with that! ;-)

 

[turducken71]

Free throw practice should be mandatory.

 

[anon_0astpxev9h4gk]

Oh yeah, this is why I don't post here nor take this board very serious. This thread is the epitome of all that is lame.

 

[J-Rye_UL]

Oh yeah, this is why I don't post here nor take this board very serious. This thread is the epitome of all that is lame.

Nailed it. This is why I spend more time on the national board.